Curretnly viewing:  Spain 2 vs England 0

Nice game indeed, Spain with Senna still holds to its EC status and has a clear domination. I guess in SA, when Senna is out for age, this will change (if Cesc is not up to the brain role, he might be, still 1.5 yrs to go)

Torres (whom all English want to see) was grey, different soccer he has gotten used to. OTOH, with Iniesta a offensive brain not much can go wrong... England has Lampard, Beckham didnt exist on the field.

I like our hymn here, the only one (except of some obscure carribean nation) w/o lyrics, only two factions that make up to win against each other: "lo, lo...lololo,...lololo, lo lo!" versus "la, la...lalala,...lalala, la la!" sounding through the stadium, *THAT IS FUN!*  :D One of the best sounding anthems I know, only the old east German anthem could compete...

VOLUME UP MODE:

This is the "correct" version (speed 76, scheme AABB, duration 52 secs according to Kings Decrete 1560/1997)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEne9DsjLeA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eEne9DsjLeA)

but I like the original march almost better as it has this slow part in the middle and is set in a different speed/tone...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0S19dt7JWQs (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0S19dt7JWQs)

VOLUME BACK TO NORMAL MODE

With military it looks like this, always a emotional moment... The King and the Prince look just sooooo goood...!  ;D (first 3 min, later desfilee)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aiofLSgqCg (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1aiofLSgqCg)

EDIT

At this stage, even with a face saving 2:0 this will be called "goleada" tomorrow and even if it is only a friendly (I like friendlies: while nobody really enters t not produce a serious lesion, they show the layout of teams better)

Rattler

P.S.: Did anybody see Italy/Brasil yesterday? I have never understood where Italy took its 5 ($ 4?) stars from.... R. (EDIT: The "$" was a typo, sorry if I offended anyone, see: http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/index.php?topic=829.msg2522#msg2522 (http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/index.php?topic=829.msg2522#msg2522))

Rattler sez:


Damn, I was just about to say something nice about the Spanish Team...

bah!

J

Oops!

Just realized the typo which could be understood as offensive, of cause my phrase should read:



On my keyboard the "$" is above the "4" had caps hit accidentally when typing. Sincere Apologies.

Rattler

Best match of the 6 I saw in the 1994 WC, surpassing even the It v Br final.

July 9th 1994 (12:00)    
Boston, Foxboro Stadium
ITALY - SPAIN    
2-1 (1-0)

      GOALS             26'  1-0  Dino Baggio (assist - Roberto Donadoni)
                                59'  1-1  Caminero (assist - Sergi)
                                88'  2-1  Roberto Baggio (assist - Giuseppe Signori)

the Belgian 'Red Devils' just make sure that not a single Belgian watches their engagements...really terrible...

??? How that? Holiganing?

Pls clarify, even we mindless fans cannot follow everything....

Rattler

I think the word 'declyning' comes into place...

this is how it was...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVBOBk8tj50 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVBOBk8tj50)

the battle of the lowlands was a returning festival of soccer between Belgium & Holland....the last years we tried very hard to avoid every solid opponent...

another heroic performance...at one point we were even congratulated by the Brazilians...
at another stage we were f*** by the referree with definitive prove on video...

those were the '80s and early '90s...now there's nothing left...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HCdxNUra_A (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HCdxNUra_A)

almost every single one video on youtube is from at least 15 years ago...

Now, after having apologized, I realize that some ppl were offended because they thought it possible that my "$" sign was meant seriously...

Well, guys, where there is smoke, usually a fire is not too far away...  ;D And the relegation of so many A-League teams for bought matches 2 yrs ago is still fairly prominent in our memories... Actually, with the Italians in soccer (and no serious offence meant) you never know...:

Check this one from (IIRC) 1994, to see how an Italian team trained
 
- faking fouls
- faking major injuries
- cheating referees
- faking being agressed by opponent

on order by signal...  ;D

The vid was used again 2004 by The Guardian in an sports campaign, still funny:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcCw9RHI5mc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcCw9RHI5mc)

Rattler

(Remember Italians are considered one of the nations that actually won WWII, and that they are the only (? AFAIK) nation where a white handkerchief is part of the regular uniform... ;D ; my WWII Africa veteran father told me the "Difference between an Italian and a German tank?: German tank: 12 forward gears, one reverse. Italian tank: 1 forward gear, 12 reverse..." ;D)

Well, the annulated goal at 1:38 there was *definitely* off side, if that is what you are refering to? The "Hand" at 3:31 is one, definitely, but still within the limits where a referee can decide on "autonomous reflex" if he wasnt close - which neither linier or referee were... - (though from my POV that was expulsion)

If it serves as a consolation:

- Spain always lost against France or Italy for 36 yrs, this year (2008) it was enough to beat them once and win the EC with great and beautiful soccer

- Spain was cheated out of the Japan/Korea WC 2002 by a Philpine refferee (who now serves prison for accepting bribes in another match) who annulated 3 perfectly legal goals - first for a non-existant fuld of Helguera who wasnt even close, 2nd for the ball being out (0.39 in slomo, not even close to line), 3rd offside allegedly with 2 mtrs to offside AND the ball coming from a Korean player 1:25; I think Morientes deserved yellow for the "Hijo de Puta" remark to the referee, though... (6 yrs later they won the EC by simply going on as they did before, playing the most beautiful national soccer on the planet - and yes, I know we lost... ;) but we did not desrve to win in this match...):

Images of a robbery:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJ_qhHsakiU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJ_qhHsakiU)

- Last, to soothe your hurts (but Henk wont like it  ;D), our German battle song in WC 2002: "Ohne Holland fahrn wir zur WM"  ;D (look for the complete lyrics, but DONT TRANSLATE THEM TO HENK!!!  :D): "Für alle Loser dieser Welt, tut uns leid, ihr müsst jetzt heim! ... Wir wünschen Guten Flug!"  :D)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j82VFs0NZY4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j82VFs0NZY4)

Rattler

Barca won, Madrid did a draw: So, again 5 points differnece, and the scales have turned...

Looking forward to the CL results.

Ratler

LOl,

I have some that are even worse about germany :)
I cant put the text up because than I might be punishable by law ;)

yeah, nice games coming on this week....

Liverpool - Real M

Man U - Inter

And Barca-Lyon also is not clear as Barca is suffering a down atm...

Rattler

Dont forget Ajax-Olympic Marseille!!

who?  :D

Ook jij kan tever gaan Koen  >:( ;)

Dutch TV shows Liverpool/Real Madrid
Belgian TV shows Juventus/Chelsea

hummmmmmm...those tough choices....

Liverpool - Real

04:00: Casilias already saves Real from a disaster....Liverpool pushing hard

place your bets: I go for 3-1

45 min: 2-0

47 min: 3-0

woooooooowwwwwwwwww...going strong  :D

4-0

Real was never in the game...

ha....let's see some MAGIC

place your bets: 3-2

just hit the 'post' button and it's 1-0

same speed as yesterday?!?

45 mins: 1-0

after a good start of Man.U. Inter took over and had the best chances...

Indeed... Humiliation as deserved...  :reddevil:

On another angle, remembering the *old* Madrid (and I am not "Merengue", I am tuly "Culé"!!! . but yo have to honor greatness... - ):

A nice take (I just *love* the Fidel Castro vesion in the vid!) on the famous Zidane Headbutt from the WC final vs. Italy (will be double posting this one to the OCPMT as "Rammstein - Du hasst mich") here, the one thing that had and will have me forever flabbergasted in soccer:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUjFRKWk6gQ (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUjFRKWk6gQ)

How can someone so distinguished and gentleman and such superior soccer player (the most complete I have seen in my 50 yrs of watching soccer:

 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_TymVHADrM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_TymVHADrM))

... destroy his fame and future (bye, bye, Platini!) in his last match... and make his team lose...  just because the other guy said " Your Sister is a Whore?" (OTOH this is probably why Italy has 5 stars?)...

OTOH,  hatsoff to being straight faced in face of an insult whith so much at stake...!

Rattler

ha...the trainer of our national football team has been fired....he achieved 'zilch', 'nothing', 'nada' but still recieves a 'fuck-off' bonus of 300.000€... :reddevil: :reddevil: :reddevil:

men...when it's that easy?

now they are asking Eric Gerets to take the task...he IS a very succesfull trainer with national titles with clubs in different countries, ex-international and a guy with a very professional attitude...

we'll see...we can't sink any lower...missing the Euro championship and probably the next World championship....

men...once we've almost beaten Brazil....almost got into the semi-final of the World championship...got the best goalie of a world championship...spent years in the top 15 of the world....now they can't find the opponents goal anymore...

Look, I do not really like any soccer from that corner (diplomatic attempt ot not say either "Holland", nor "Belgium", as you *need* to show some respect, after all, that is a *game*...  hihi
... and WWII to my knowledge has ended a few years ago..  hdbng.)


DISCLAIMER befor I comment on the case:
===========================

I know you BNL guys see it different because of a special sensitivity (having been occupied by our Nazi troops):  "Forgive and Forget" please (?)! "What you talking about?  8) "... I myself wasn´t even born that time but will, if you say so, accept that I am - (still ?) - responsible today...


=============================

Now, that said, let us talk Belgium stats and actions as far as their soccer team goes...:


Barcelona went to Guardiola as "Mister" and nobopdy believedthis was a good choice, the same (on club level) situation as your selection faces, now Barca set the standard clubwise in Europe (- sorrry any BM fans, I am German, but BM *really* is the antichrist from an Eintracht Frankfurt POV; 4:0  iconclap):

I strongly believe (though I think that Barca will fall to Chelsea just for history reasons) that your decision to go for Gerets is a wise choice for the Belgian team:

The man has ideas, knows about the athletic quality to soccer today and can - fromo my POV - well discern which players to chose for which style (I think the Belgians will always have to take it from the physcial or standard situation side).

You dont make it today, maybe, but you will be one of the upper ones in the future again. Those youngsters know what they wan and ow to play soccer as a team.

The fact that those youngsters are vulnerable (BM is playing currently aginst their youngster coach JK - well, here the clubs probably have to rethink their wages/value relations: If a coach/trainer/mister has no financial value compared to any of their players they will always have to live with a team simply "playing" him out if they do not like his schedule, hours off, general rules or etc...) is more valid on club basis than in a selection: JK as national trainer was the most acclaimed national coach ever in Germany, though he olny trained one sasison and did not get even one title...

Seriously, I think you guys will paint in soccer again (speaking national selections) in the near future...

My 2c.

Rattler

Why are not all penalties executed like this?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjGbB0_fUXA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IjGbB0_fUXA)

Due to a recent event (Casillas on Tuesday killed a penalty shot á la "Panenka", after 0:28 in this vid - and Pepe is out for 10 matches for 1. Agression, 2. Insulting the Ref. 3. Re-entering the field after having been expelled, and 2 cases more... He will be fined tenth of thousands of Euros by the club and will be sold -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMmjzpt5Du4 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMmjzpt5Du4)

), I had voiced in a discussion that the only sure way to make a penalty (more so if it is really critical and not in the penalty shoot out - where other laws apply - ) enter is to make it a rehearsed pass as in this classic Cruyff one that I rembered, but some ppl said it was illegal now under UEFA AND FIFA rules.

I did not find anything in the rules posted on the net (or do not understand them sufficiently) http://www.uefa.com/uefa/mediaservices/regulations/index.html, (http://www.uefa.com/uefa/mediaservices/regulations/index.html,) any experts out there?

Comments much appreciated,

Rattler

P.S.: If you do not know what a "Panenka" is, check this (Panenka shot Chechoslowakia to their only European Champion title beating Sepp Maier with a lob right into the center of the goal and has been imitated often since):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBiQJDkxlGU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kBiQJDkxlGU)

this weekend,in the german first bundesliga,one player of  "karlsruher sc (short KSC) "shoots the luckiest goal i ever saw,and take the win against "bayer leverkusen" !but just watch yourself.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch0hKy-gxLI (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch0hKy-gxLI)

Great Matt, I actually saw that game in the stadium:)
This was a great laugh.

Tomorrow the decisive match here (and for the first time in 15 matches before over the years will it be decisive):

Madrid- Barca!

I have heard it is going to be televised in the whole world, and I can just hope that soccer once shows justice and that the ball does  whatever necessary to reward those who treated it so great this whole season... (but, as soccer is usually not just... I fear the worst...)

Here the (satirical) take that we have seen in a program (Crackovia) where actors more or less resembling the actual players/coaches/presidents (in this case of Barca) comment on the situation in the Spanish league (the interesting part starts after 1:45 : In the beginning you can see (gay) coach Guardiola trying to motivate his players with the Goldberg Variatiions of J.S Bach (watch Puyol´s, Iniesta´s  and Etoo´s faces, priceless!), then there is a discussion about how "Poems and Literature" are the most important things for a soccer player (to which the players correct: "*Three" things, mister..." - apart form what Etoo mentions: Titties, cars and party - "...Cup, Leauge and Champions!", explainig it by performing the old Queen song with this theme (and leave Guardiola not understanding anything), Prezzie Laporta with the tie around his head equally hilarious:

Cup, League and Champions!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acKZR7OrAMA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acKZR7OrAMA)

(and we still need some little revenge for the forced "pasillo" of 2008 when the league was already decided at the time of the match and Madrid had made champion... NOTE that I as sportsman and being "Culé" have no probs with playing the Madrid hymn here!):

Pasillo of Barca Hailing The Champions 2008:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKVw6PCJdOA (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKVw6PCJdOA)

Now, we shall see, whatever happens, Barca will still be leader after this match with 4 more to go...

Aupa Barca!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifgU_2O236M (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifgU_2O236M)

Rattler

arrrgghhh! My post of yesterday does not show, probably hit peview instead of "Post".

Will correct ASAP, stby.

Rattler

Here goes my post from last night, edited a bit in hindsight...




Indeed, I went to see the match (just now returned) in a "Merengue" bar (i.e. Madrid Fans Bar) like every year, this time with two youngsters (10 yrs, one "Merengue" and the other one, like myself, "Culé") and I have never seen so many tears of ppl that old in a situation where nobody had died...

2:6!!!

A Culé dream come true, and I am not yet out of it (no team ever made 6 goals in the Bernabeu during the time I have been watching soccer, and this is many a years... it for sure is the first time ever Barca scored 6 in the Bernabeu), the stadium applauding to Barca (and for that: "Hats Off!" sincerely to the Madrid fans, Barca fans have never done it in similar situations - to their shame from my POV -).

Of cause, in a situation like this you cannot talk to the Merengues (and probably not for the next 3 days) seriously, all were crying and even a word of consolation would have come over as offensive and arrogant (remember that by declaring yourself Merengue or Culé you make a political statement almost more than a statement about soccer: Madrid was/stands for/is Franco and the Dictatroship (in his time Madrid had to win all titles in Spain, the refs were paid to make sure they did, and many ppl haven´t forgotten: This is why Madrid still is the club with the most titles in the world), Barca was/stands for/is The Republic of Inedependant Catalonia and the Transition To Democracy...), but I really had to finally consolate that 85 yrs old Guardia Civil Major (actually, the bar owner) who burned his 70 yrs old Madrid Club Membership Card and declared that he had just lost faith in the Spanish Nation and its pride, I do not know whether I succeeded, seemed everything I and others were saying just was more salt into his wounds...

Anyway,

from my POV soccer for the 2nd time in just 12 month did justice to style, team and coach work this time, and we saw an epic match of the purest and most refined club soccer I have ever had a chance to see:

The 2:6 was well deserved, it could have been 2:10 if it had not been for Casillas (who paraded 2 or 3 goals that were already sung) or the referee (who did not give 2 clear penalties to Barca)...

Madrid gave all it had, which is pride, courage, fight (they ran marathons) and with Robben even a bit of glamour and deseqilibrium, but winning against the best team of the globe with those means only is like trying to invade the US with a tug boat and a yacht...

Those neverending triangles formed by Messi, Iniesta and Xavi or Xavi, Etoo and Henry (I like the triangle method Guardiola implemented, a pyramide right from Valdez dwn to the goal) were never ever met by Metzelder, Heinze, Lass and Gago, sometimes Barca would let the ball circulate for 5 min and the Madrileños never had a chance to even touch it - though they tried hard going with up to three at each Barca ball bearer - , waiting patiently for the gap and then execute brilliance in a way that it actually looked really easy.

It was no surprise, really, what happened at the Bernabeu, it was simply - soccer...  :champ: Brilliance vs. Impotence, and the end of a lie.

Chelsea beware!

Player ratings individually: http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1771/yahoo/2009/05/02/1242770/player-ratings-real-madrid-2-6-barcelona (http://www.goal.com/en-us/news/1771/yahoo/2009/05/02/1242770/player-ratings-real-madrid-2-6-barcelona)



Well, now off to bed and trying to not awake from the dream...

A quick summary of the goals (1-0, m.14: Higuaín. 1-1, m.17: Henry. 1-2, m.20: Puyol. 1-3, m.35: Messi. 2-3 m.55: Sergio Ramos. 2-4, m.58: Henry. 2-5, m.75: Messi. 2-6, m.83: Piqué.) and Highlights (in HQ):

Real Madrid vs FC Barcelona 2-6 [2/05/09] HQ Full Highlights (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDAHobvsjl8#)

Rattler

Nice.

Ajax lost today with 4-0 from Sparta (last position in the leauge)
They lost the chance to play CL now :(

Stupid bunch of spoiled millionairs, at the most important stage of the competition losing from a bunch of amateurs.

Just saw that one now, amazing, dont know how I missed it before...

Thanks for sharing!

Rattler

As I posted the following in another forum:




Okies, so we made it !!!!!

Luckily, I might add, because the ref indeed erred many times: Between 1-3 - according to your fan colors - penalties not given for Chelsea, and, to compensate, an expulsion - Abidal! The Weak Link! - that was none (Abidal was about a yard away when Drogba did the "Diver").

But, despite the early goal of Chelsea (I saw the game in the same Madrid Bar, and: Again Hats Off! they wanted Barca to win...) I never lost faith, because one goal was not the problem: Barca had to score one anyway, with or without a counter goal, and I was somehow sure they would make it, finally...

We had a cartoon in the newspaper today of Hiddink, who -when asked about the strategy for the match - said: "Simple: 1:0 in minute 89, sop that when they get mad they have no time to react....". I never imagined it would be the other way around, but see for yourself the last 2 minutes of the match (not much soccer during the whole match, but a duel of Beauty and Beast, where the Beauty luckily made it), some minutes no soccer fan will ever forget: Minute 92: Barcelona with 10, all seems lost, but they never lose their style, no panic, the machine at work (possession 29:71%), and then: *INIESTA!!!!* (IMHO the best Spanish player atm) scores the saving 1:1... (and the referee let them play on til minute 98...). I called the goal at the pass of Messi, could only be then or never...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOofD1T_4gM (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WOofD1T_4gM)

Versus Manchester this will be easier, as they are playing more open (and we will have Puyol and Henry back), but we lost Dani Alvez (sanctioned) and probably Abidal (though I am sure this red expulsion will be recurred successfully).

Rome!!! Here we come!

Please do not wake me....

Rattler

Chelsea punished for their anti-football football, both matches of Chelsea I went to bed after the 1st half...

Indeed...

Rattler

a pretty thrilling match was the second game in the uefa-cup semifinal between the "hamburger sv" and my favorit club "werder bremen".teh first game ended 0:1 for hamburg.in the last minutes of the game,bremen leads 2:1 and was in the final so far.then they scored the securing 3:1 after a cornerkick.but look how curious it comes for the cornerkick......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNcIOzRpZvk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNcIOzRpZvk)

Socer is a neverending chain of surprises and injustices, that is why we love it: Life itself...

Congrats!

Rattler

your right  hatsoff

but the best thing is that the hamburger fans throw the paperball themself at the field  :champ:

So, tonight is the night...:

From Leo Messi to Cristiano Ronaldy, from Edwin van der Saar to Victor Valdés, from Thierry Henry to Ryan Giggs, samuel Etoó to Wayne Rooney, Michael Carrick to Xavi Hernandez, from Andres Iniesta to Carlitos Tévez, it is an impressive amount of great soccer players that meet tonight in Rome in confrontation, I expect one of the best matches I have seen in my life time (and probably will see ever).

Hard to tell which team might be better positioned, but from the numbers we can draw some conlcusions:

Barca plays 4-3-3, ManU 4-4-2; some comparisons seem in order.

Victor Valdés - Edwin van der Saar (2): The Spaniard is younger (12 yrs less). 54 matches played in Champions versus 81 of the goalie from Netherlands. Barcas goalie received 0.86 in the league and 0.92 in Champions, the Dutch is better: 0.64 in league and 0.75 in Champions. I am sure ManU will score, Barca will find it more difficult to score one more than they will. Barca 0 - ManU 1

Carles Puyol - John O´Shea (1): While the Barca Captain will play as a flank defense (not his position) because both Dani Alves and Abidal cannot play) and has completed an irregular season, he will be hard to beat: The Irishman, one of the most reuglar players used bxy Fergusson, offers compromise, but not much more. Barca 1 - ManU 1

Yaxa Touré - Rio Ferdinand (2): Touré also plays (for the reasons mentioned) in a position he does not occupy normally and has proved towice that he can. But, he never had to face some strikers way much faster than himself. Rio, despite just coming from an injury, is one of the best defenses in the world. Barca 1 - ManU 2

Gerard Piqué - Nenamja Vidic (X): ManU let the Catalán Pique go because they felt they had enough good defenders, he has responded perfectly in his home club and brought in fresh air. This will compensate for his technical problems (still very young and lacking experience), he is the largest in the team and might score from a standard. The Serb, otoh, is one guy who does not show any deficiencies, effective and solid. Barca 1 - ManU 2

Keita- Evra (2): I dont like what Giuardiola decided here, Keita is a midfielder and only plays defense because of Abidals absence. He himself states that he cannot do that well. The Frrenchman, otoh, is in his position, hard to overcome and has a lot of offensive powers for counters. Barca 1 - ManU 3

Busquets - Carrick (2): Busquest has been one of the relevations of this season, better than his father, but he is lacking experience and it shows under pressure. Carrick (as midfield one of the center pieces in Manchesters offensive play) should theoretically do better simply due to experience. Barca 1 - ManU 4

Xavi- Scholes (1): Both are the symbols in their teamd, the brains (or part of it). Xavi is at his peak, whereas Scholes is declining (just for age reasons, he is 34). Same goes for Giggs, should he play (35). Still Scholes can do anything that seems impossible, and anytime. Barca 2 - ManU 4

Iniesta - Anderson (1): As the other half of Barca´s "brain" he can alway and at any time win agiainst the double defensive line of ManU. Only problem, his injury: He has trained two days with the team an might fall injured again easily (which, from my POV would mean Barca could kiss goodbyue the cup). Anderson is an excellent pressurer, but no match to Iniesta in verticality. Barca 3 - ManU 4

Messi - Ronaldo (1): This is a risky bet I am making here, but they are very different players: Ronaldo is fast w/o the ball (probably the fastest in Europe, 50 mtrs sprints to appear out ot nothing are his typical style), whereas Messi is probably the fastest in the world with the ball glued to his feet. While the match is not (as press says) a duel between the two, if matched I prefer Messi. Barca 4 - ManU 4

Eto´o - Rooney (X): If well, Eto´o should win against Rooneys talent and sacrifice anytime, but he has allowed himself to become obsessioned with the "Pichichi" (which he just lost against Forlan in the league, 30 opportunities and did not score one goal incl two failed penalties) and the Golden Boot, all this makes him nervous and uncertain... If I was the mister, I would not place him in the intitial team... Barca 4 - ManU 4

Henry - Park (1): Henrry´s last chance to carry a big title, he comes from injury as Iniesta (also only two days training with the team after 6 weeks), but he is the natural killer that can score from any positions and stance (left, right, head). The Corean has improved a lot and knows to hide his techinical deficiencies, but is no match in comparison IMHO. Barca 5 - ManU 4

The reserves (2): Barca: Gudjohnson, Hleb, Bojan are good but not in form (except Bojan who will be the ideal suppement both for Eto´o or Henry). Manchester with Berbatov, Nani, Tevez and Giggs (Scholes) offers more opportunities. Barca 5 - ManU 5

So well balanced, I see ManU as the favorite:

- Evra has shown in the semifinals of last year that he can neutralize Messi one whole match.

- Barca has no defense, and Dani Alves is heavily missed.

- ManU is champion (and has eliminated Barca last year in semis)

- Too much for Barca depens on just Iniesta and Henry

I expect Barca to play its usuall style with lots of posession (following the Cruyff doctrne: If you have the ball, the opponent cannot score) and ManU to play counter. With the fast Ronaldo and all the talent accumulated there (and also the majority of supporters) this might well work out and even terminate Barca losing big time. Also, we have been lucky with th referee vs. Chelsea, so Murphy´s Law dictates that this time it will go aginst us (though I sincerly hope this great match will not be decided by a bad referee!).

As always, I am with Barca, but I fear for the worst, looking forward to this match like to none other...

Rattler

YEP: ZE BIG FINAL!



same here!  :champ:

65 min: Barca 1-0 Man U....thrilling  smallclap

67 min: Barca 2-0 Man U

Over and Out?

 :champ:  :D  woohoo  :dance:  :drama:  hicks

(http://www.adn.es/clipping/ADNIMA20071215_0688/3.jpg)

What a game! Barca made history (first one ever in Spain to get the triple), and I am glad that I won´t have to repeat my entry from last year: http://ohlmer.es/blog/30 (http://ohlmer.es/blog/30) , great job and well deserved!

Really the best soccer team in Europe at the moment, and it will be years to see that soccer and those results again... :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8b8cGhxhAsY (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8b8cGhxhAsY)

Rattler

I would have preferred Man U but the best team won...without a doubt

...no time now, but wait for my detailed analysis, you have seen history happen - live! I am sure you will always remember this MAY 27...

Rattler

damn...promises....you shouldn't make them.... hihi

Koen, here my (not so  ;D) serious response:

Hey, I have it all prepared... it is just that I had (and have) no time to post now (as it is moot anyway it has not priority at all more than being probably valued as a historical review of one of the more than 1.500 Millions better coaches in some 10+ yrs...), I have a few otherissues to address currently (and this part *is* serious):

- work schedule from 0600J in the morning (but - since JUN 1 and until AUG 31 -
, free after 1530J :) )

- mobbing at one of my (actually my major income source) jobs which (the mobbing: 20 emails a day to my boss from ENY daily , with my boss reuqesting me to contest) occupies me 3 hours a day entirely (and I will most probably find myself without sufficient income for maintaining life after OCT 1 for this reason)

- a business opportunity which could raise me some 30.000 Euros within 3 month if I follow through, and with a bit of luck (and no (!) risk involved, just work outside working hours)... Want to guess my priorities ATM???  ???

- End/start of month with all paperwork involved... (Hacienda!!! ;( )

- Murphy has it that all the forums where I am tech admin suddenly encounter strange problems that need to be attended *urgently*...  :D

So, please (to stick with soccer language) keep the ball *low* ATM with me...  whipit. This said, you can speed up my response by posting *your own analysis*, thats for sure, as I only would have to answer and take it apart  waa...  ;D

If I can - I have one hour between 0500 and 0600J every morning, and again another one (not so fit then) after 2000J , ( and all JULIET times same as your´s) - I will post it, late or not.

Request you guys to stand by patiently  :whistle:.

Rattler

no problem dude...

I was disappointed in the game...I expected the game of games...

Today I saw the fault( or rather criminal attack) on a Belgian player..difficult name.
He broke his leg very bad, he had a terrible look on his face.

What bothers me even more is that the club from the player who did this gives him an excuse and protects him.

Axel Witsel Tackle Wasilewski Leg Break (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-2nJC67Zf8#ws-normal)

this isn't a tackle...on TV you can see his eyes turning towards his victim and then he puts his feet in a vertical movement down...football is a horizontal sport...

yes, his club says it's not done on purpose but by accident...yeah...sure....right...

red ... and a long time sanction.

This *was* on purpose, as Koen says, you can see it.

Rattler

Dick Advokaat become the new trainer of the Belgian National team today. I hope he can put some of the "Hollander" passion in them and make play 100 procent better :p

yes, we all hope...haven't watched a Red Devils aka Red Pussies match for a LONG time  hdbng

yeah, an old Dutch joke says : he doesnt want to have anything to do with soccer for two years ;) waa

hahahahahahahaha  hihi

I admire the guy greatly for taking on such a difficult task, he wont have an easy time :p

I'm sure he'll be getting plenty of euros for it!

2nd in command is Wilmots, a great player and bilangual...

in our fantasy soccer league 13th_redneck is slowly gaining on me, let´s see how this weekend will turn out, will keep you updated... The big problem is the constant rotation, especially in Sevilla and Madrid, I always seem to end up with players that do not play: I have had 3 Sevilla players this weekend, Sevilla won 4:0, but none of my guys played though they had played all 4 games before (but then the players I had from Sevilla did not play, so I changed to them this week ... St. Elm Serpientes ZERO points.... :(

13th Redneck had the Sevilla goalie, at keeping his box to zero, that is 16 points more than me again... Grrrrr!

Rattler

I am not sure whether this is the right place to post, I think we *need* an orbituaties section, but:

Today, an icon of Spanish Basket Ball and Soccer moderation on TV was found dead in his house, only 2 weeks after his last program appearance, and not really old (50+, my age...?): Andrés Montes is dead!

(http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_xNZtv4xn0yk/SqwDfvIi1iI/AAAAAAAAE14/BRw07mLTDHU/s320/andres-montes-recomienda-van-morrison-thumb.jpg)

Non Spanish Speakers the name might not tell anything, but he is the one guy that on his own revolutionized TV coverage of Basket (in "Canal+") and later Soccer (in "La Sexta") with his unique and sometimes controversial style of letting his mouth follow his heart... and always ended every report with "...and life can be really beautiful!..." ("... y la vida puede ser maravillosa!...)

OTW he created his own dictionary/thesaurus of expressions and phrases that today have become part of everyday Spanish language, like (and this as a kind of tranlsation service):

- "Pincho de Merluza" to describe a defensive block in  Basket (that is translated a "Cod spear" and refers to the cheapest Spanish food in the early 20th century that would "block the hunger")

- "The Helicopter" for a dunk

- "Jugon" for a great player

- "Ratatatatatatatatatatatatatatatatatatatataaa (repeated if necessary)....!!!!" for a great game move or an announced triple from far away

- "tiqui-taqua" for a nice technical move/dribbling or combination in soccer

- "Vilmaaaa!"... (abre me la puerta!) which translates to "Wilmaaaa!...." (open the door!) from the Flintstones, used to describe clear misses of the basket or the goal when there was no defense involved - one of the standards in everyday Spanish by today for almost every request...

He named every player along his own ideas: Jordan and Gasol "E.T.", Pujol "Tiburon" (shark), etc. etc....

His unique face, dressing style and penetrating, unforgettable voice: A "genius" lost... and will be missed... Thanks for giving us sooooo much fun, and "... la vida puede ser maravillosa!..."   R.I.P. !

EDIT 1.12.10: Again videos deleted by Google/Youtube, replaced as good as possible, but of course not on the exact hit of my post then...

EDIT: Here you can see (hear) his style, a true Wolfman Jack of sports reportage...:
Andrés Montes Frases (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKYNsXL5CTk#)

A first hommage vid out today, with all the famous phrases, his dictionary when he was with "La sesta" (he was actually with "la seXta"  hihi):
EDIT MOMENTOS ANDRÉS MONTES (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtRvofQccOY#)

One of the great matches I saw moderated by him (in team), my Barca vs. Madrid 2:0 :), he lets it all out!
FC Barcelona 2 0 Real Madrid La Sexta Andres Montes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=panhib3OSGk#normal)

Hasta siempre, jugón!  :cry:

MOMENTOS ANDRÉS MONTES (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtRvofQccOY#normal)

Rattler

Update on mine and 13th battle for the Spanish Fantasy League:

After 6 days 13th has 251,5 points, myself 252,5, so it´s a close match: Winning by one point does not mean anything, on the 5th day I was more than 20 behind... but now coming on strong :)

Rattler

If you are one that loves good soccer or if you are anti-Madrid then you had a great night yesterday: A 3rd league team beat Real Madrid 4:0 (!) in the cup (but RMA is sure to take revenge in the re-match in the Bernabeu, they don´t feel eliminatd yet).

This not with a team of supplements, but with a real RMA on the grass... The galctians lost against planet Earth, vs. a team that played with verve, speed, aggressiveness, exhibiting basic soccer virtutes, a great goalie (and with a bit of luck and a striker - Borja - that now has made 6 vs. RMA in three consecutive years and 3 different teams, he is one player that comes from RMA but was mustered out because "...he simply does not meet the futbolistic standards of this club..."  :reddevil:).

Marca sums it up like this (translation by me... http://www.marca.com/2009/10/27/futbol/copa_rey/1256683945.html (http://www.marca.com/2009/10/27/futbol/copa_rey/1256683945.html)):




See to believe, players worth 250 Millions of Euros on the grass losing 4:0 vs. a team with a 800.000 Euros budget:

Alcorcón 4 - 0 Real Madrid Copa del Rey (27/10/09) HISTORICA HUMILLACIÓN HISTORICAL HUMILIATION (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eLrh_YWjkSc#normal)

Alcorcón 4 Madrid 0 27-10-2009 Copa del Rey . (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1zzWeiyG4k#normal)

Viva el Alcorcón!

4. Alcorcón: Juanma; Rubén Sanz, Iñigo López, Borja Gómez, Nagore; Rubén Sanz; Ernesto Gómez (Jeremy, min.65), Sergio Mora, Fernando Bejar (Carmelo, min. 75); Diego Cascó y Borja Pérez (Bravo, min.82).

0. Real Madrid: Dudek; Arbeloa, Albiol, Metzelder, Drenthe; Mahamadou Diarra, Guti (Gago, min,46), Van der Vaart; Granero (Marcelo, min.63); Raúl (Van Nistelrooy, min. 72) y Benzema.

Goals: 1-0, min 16: Borja; 2-0, min 22: Arbeloa auto-goal; 3-0, min 40: Ernesto; 4-0, min 52: Borja.

Rattler

Soccer doesn't really interest me.  If I ever watch it, it's just to check the guys out.  hihi     ;)

woooow Rattler...what a humiliation  hdbng

Here in Spain this is a national thing, not one news show that does not at least devote 10 minutes to what now has been dubbed by "Marca" 'Alcorcongate'.

Taking a look at the national newspapers headlines (and I am not only talking the sports papers here) says it all (scrolll down):

http://enlacesdeldia.hagoclic.com/2009/10/28/terremoto-en-alcorcon-alcorcon-4-real-madrid-0/ (http://enlacesdeldia.hagoclic.com/2009/10/28/terremoto-en-alcorcon-alcorcon-4-real-madrid-0/)

and also in the international papers it has it´s repercussions (even CNN opened the day with it in the US):

http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/292153,spanish-media-mock-real-madrid-after-cup-shock--feature.html (http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/292153,spanish-media-mock-real-madrid-after-cup-shock--feature.html)

http://www.goal.com/en/news/12/spain/2009/10/28/1589359/spanish-press-slam-real-madrid (http://www.goal.com/en/news/12/spain/2009/10/28/1589359/spanish-press-slam-real-madrid)

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?from=rss_Sport&set_id=6&click_id=4&art_id=nw20091028103517697C454049 (http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?from=rss_Sport&set_id=6&click_id=4&art_id=nw20091028103517697C454049)

Rattler

LOL nice to see those millionaires defeated that way ;)

Ajax just beat up Feyenoord in our only classic game of the year :)
Only 5-1, players lost accuracy and tried to do some gallery play, if they had remained sharp it could have been 10-1 :(
feyenoord received two red cards :)
Gabri again played a very good match.
he has been away due to an inury for several months, today he played his second game, and it was just as if he never had been away!

Spanish League Reuslts and table, day 9:

http://es.soccerway.com/national/spain/primera-division/2009-2010/regular-season/ (http://es.soccerway.com/national/spain/primera-division/2009-2010/regular-season/)

Looks my constant work starts paying off, my Sant Elm Serpients now have a solid 70 points lead on 13th_rednecks Real Andorra in the yahoo fantasy soccer league... http://es.superliga.fantasysports.yahoo.com/football/ (http://es.superliga.fantasysports.yahoo.com/football/) :)

Rattler

Elizabeth Lambert fights: New Mexico vs BYU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EDWGPTGyhsg#normal)
 ???

48 hours to the "Classic", this year tainted by politics, but I still expect to see a good game, with all players on the field: Messi and Ibra from the Barca side, and CR9 on the Madrid side...

Of cause I expect a condundent win by Barca (but this year it won´t be sooo easy as the 2:6 they gave them end of last season) :)

Can´t hardly wait.... :)

Rattler

good news for the Belgian fans: http://www.prime.be/nl/sport/football/openstadion/ (http://www.prime.be/nl/sport/football/openstadion/)

we can see the complete match for free on our digital decoders-TV  :champ:

We will see 500 Millions of Euros (750 Millions of $) worth of soccer players on the field:

As Madrid only has Casillas from its own youth, they will have put more money on the field, roughly 330 Millions, with CR9 for 94 Millions being the most expensive.

Barca, with many of it´s own players coming from their youth (Valdez, Xavi, Iniesta, Messi, Bojan, etc), will only have a total of 160 Millions playing, with Ibrahimovic with 86 Millions as the most expenisve being the equivalent off all other 7 players together that Barca had to pay for...

Incredible...

Rattler

yeah, I enjoy their game but have doubts with the money that's playing on the fields...what could be done 'good' with all that money?

As a Barca fan, tonight is this years night of the nights, this week is the week of weeks:

Chanpions: Barca had played (with a superb expression of soccer) 2:2 in London, this night is the return  match (in Barcelona).

Both teams face serious problems: In Arsenal (which has al Spain worried for the WC) Cesc Fabregas is down for 3 month for a ligament  injury, in Barca it is worse: The normal central defense with Puyol and Piquets absent for accumulation of yellows, Iniesta and Ibrahimovic down for injury...

Guardiola (for not Barca fans: The Mister) has tried a formation vs. Atletico Bilbao in the league this weekend with 6 guys from the second team, result (with again an exhibition of the same soccer the main team plays) 4:1, so not everything is lost...

Then, at the weekend, Madrid vs. Barca: Madrid (who lost 2:6 last year, just scroll up the page a bit much to: http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/the-lounge-get-a-beer-go-off-topic/soccer-anyone-%28the-neverending-soccer-thread%29/msg3960/#msg3960 (http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/the-lounge-get-a-beer-go-off-topic/soccer-anyone-%28the-neverending-soccer-thread%29/msg3960/#msg3960)) have improved a lot after investing 340 Million Euros (90 just for C. Ronaldo = "CR9" - roumors have it that they are intending to get permission from the federations to change his shirt number from "9" to "90.000.000" but haven´t found nough space on the shirt yet... :) ), and as they are tied in points (and Madrid leading by one goal) this probably will be the decisive match of the season (first round in Barcelona 1:0).

Of cause, shold Barca get eliminated tonight, this would influence this important weekend game also...

Interesting and emotional week, Barca with the best combinative soccer of the planet (4 goals more than same date last year when they won all 6 world wide possbile titles for the first time in history for any team) facing the two most effective teams on the planet (Madrid has 1 goal more and have never scored below two in a match, Arsenal has won all their out matches).

Onwards, soccer fans, tune in tonight and saturday at 2200 local, you surely won´t regret the time spent!

Rattler

thx for reminding me it's tuesday today (with that free monday my schedule is f*** up)

I saw the Barca game last week and I was still a bit disappointed.... 2-2??? while they were so much better?

And Barca-Galacticos is also here on payed TV saturday  :champ:

Here my take (match has not started yet):

Yes they were better, light years better actually, but playing in foreign territory (playing at home has a  testosterone boost of 80% for home players, home/away yes has a backround) hampers, so some of the other possible 10 goals just did not go in (the 1 centimeter difference  is luck to some point, and adrenaline which is testosterone triggered).

I expect Barca to fill their wretched defense (for tonight, against the anti christ they will play with their full force) with Marquez, and I also expect Guardiola to trust his A youth (Bojan, Pedro etc: No club has a better youth than Barca atm, though, of cause, they will lack "experience" which in champions influences). Anyway, history is against them, nobody won Champions twice (but, plz, let them make semis!).

Let us see, kick off now, I might chime in in half time again.

On the next game its (ex-)galacticos (much better than last season, actually, to be fair, in total in the league averaging Barca of last year) vs. Barca and not the other way around, "merengue" home turf and we "culés" will be suffering, a draw would be great for us. Of cause, and I can only repeat the importance of todays match, if we get eliminated today.... forget all titles.

Rattler

min 18: F.....!!!! Arsenal 0:1, and what is more, for a ref fault/ball loss fault....?

Rattler

I was about to write on my modifying this message: "Now Messi has to save us again", when he already scored, and a super goal, after pass from "Pedro" (he is *not* "Pedrito" (= "little Pedro") anymore, though his dress still says so: The only player of Spanish history that scored in all 6 competitions in one year! A-youth Barca all the way!... :) )

min 20: 1:1 after goal from Messi.

Rattler

Again, Messi is instoppable when Barca is donw in the ring, another unbelievable goal from a sound preparation, and just the 15 centimeters ahead of the defender that make the difference: Min 37, 2:1, gooooooooool Meeeeeeesssi! !!

Rattler

still....hard working goal from Bentner....and brilliant from Messi....

damn....typing his name gave him the urge to score again  :champ:

... and again: 3:1 Messi, minute 39... :)

Actually, this best player of all times just broke another record (sorry Stoffel), maximal scorer in European competitions now, van Basten is relegated to 2nd place as of today... :)

OTOH he is only human, just missed the 4:1 he had on his toe...

Rattler

Halftime result: Messi vs. Arsenal 3:1

hattrick in Champions League....damn....

still possible:

I stand corrected (had not being pulling from the net, just off -my bad - memory). Overall not even, Raul (Real Madrid) is the top scorer with 64, Messi is closing in with 57.

Now (after Abidals re-injury and swap for Maxwell, another really down thingy for defense... from wretched to disastrous now...) they are going defensive, Bojan out and Touré in, I thinks this is a mistake that the might pay dearly (any draw wil have Barca elimintated now).

What is worse, that is not their style, they do not even know how to play defensive, I can only pray Iniesta comes in (they are failing in the midfield) and that he will not re-injure (one week for a muscular injury seems almost impossible??)

Rattler

Min 74: A pity Rosicky goes out, for me one of the best on the pitch, but of cause Wenger now tries everything with new forces (though I think Eduardo is not even on the same planet as Rosicky).

R.

I was right, he isnt: Min 76: Eduardo goes solo and fails to come close to the goal from 37 metres, two free players to his right ignored.

R.

10 minutes to go, we can start dreaming about the semi-final (final would be in the stadium of ***MADRID***!!)... The opponent in semi would be Inter Milan, who won vs Moscow by goal of an ex Madrid player, Wesley Snijder. Seems a managable oppnent, 10 minutes for not to see two goals of Arsenal...

Rattler

6 min to go, seems Arsenal has resigned, the next of Barca seems in the air, everybody trying to give Messi his 4th... Pedro out and, finally, Iniesta in (he will be sooooo needed on saturday).

R.

min 88 with 2 to go: 4th of Messi!!!!! History made! Max goaler in one champions match! (Koen, check your stats, no other quadruple in *champions*  EDIT: After Eights Finals...).

4:1 vs. a club as great as Arsenal is also something to witness, had not thought it possible...

Messi! When the club is down, he responds and is there! http://lionelmessi.org/ (http://lionelmessi.org/)

Himne del F.C. Barcelona (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8b8cGhxhAsY#)

Rattler

Check out this guy, really, 10 secs pitch interview with "La Pulga" (the flee) Messi:

"I did not play really well today, but the team helped me to make me look better than I was. We need to work a lot more to become better, but now we have a chance to see the final and to win Madrid on saturday"...

 :champ:

Rattler

Barcelona: Vermaelen, Belgian defender in Arsenal (who played a good game) admitted afterwards that the talent in Barcelona was too big for them, they were too fast...

Man U - Bayern

seems that Rooney is ready for the game????? makes ALOT of difference!

I give Man U better chances even with a negative 1-2

Bayern also has a Belgian defender...Van Buyten...important and always present and ready

WTF??????????????????  2min45 1-0

guys...really...I keep on running from the sofa to my PC

2-0  :champ:

man o man...CL is great...

in a couple of minutes...3-0...3-1

thx for the show guys  hatsoff

now on TV: Standard (B) - Hamburg (D)

http://sporza.be/cm/sporza/voetbal/2.4983?matchid=1416380 (http://sporza.be/cm/sporza/voetbal/2.4983?matchid=1416380)

http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/matches/season=2010/round=2000040/match=2000960/index.html (http://www.uefa.com/uefaeuropaleague/matches/season=2010/round=2000040/match=2000960/index.html)

Indeed, and for me Bayern is the kind of anti-christ, soccer wise. Madrid never should have sold Robben...

Now standing by for Saturdays "classic", we already have one joke: Madrid, allegedly panicking on how to stop Messi (looks like Pelligrini is obsessed with that and will be opting for a mix of 3 placyers: Arbeloa (who did successfully so in three different clubs), Gaga and Garay; personally I think it is a waste of time, probably then Bojan or Pedro have more room...), have found the solution, finally:

The only sure way to stop Messi is...

...to install Maradona as coach...  waa

Rattler

10 minuts to go, and I want to express my feelings about "the match of the millenium" before (oh, the media!: That *must* be a joke, the only time frame I would accept is *the decade*, every attribute above shows not understanding&/commenting soccer).

I have interviewed around 500 ppl the last three days, a good average of semi profeionals, professionals and laymen, and nobody wants to commit who wil win this nights Madric-Barca.

Not surprisingly so, Madrid is not the Madrid from last year where prepotence ended in a historical 2:6 humiliation, they are fight, concentration and effectiveness this season (350 Million Euros must be good for something...).

As I am ashamed of nobody wanting to take a set (no betting this year, at 50:50 first glance Mallorquins are not going to put money, they only bet when *they think* the outcome is clear), here my personl bet: Draw or Madrid win is what I foresee (though I have enough reasons to feel I might be -as Barca fn luckily - be wrong).

Madrid plays aat home, and are representing "fight" in soccer, a merit all by itself as the numbers state and confirm. Barcelona out, and representing the best soccer played on the planet in the last two years, but with a truly botvhrd defense.

Referee has his last match today (one more in the cup, but he has not to worry about critizism with his 45 yrs), and is a devoted Madrid fan (they caught him 3 years ago in a Madrid game telling a player bvefore match start: "Dont worry, you wont lose") with following statistics: 26 games rf´ed where Madrid played in his 30 yrs history, Madrid lost 7%, and *not one* since 1999. For Barca he ref´d 25 matches in the same period, in which Barca lost 63 %, most after discussed referre blunders (actually, many of the Madrid wins were also part of heavy discussion, comes to mind the "phantasy goal" where the ball failed to hit the goal but he gave it scored).

Let us see, now kick off, my bet: 2:1, just to say something...

Fight vs. art, we will know what serves afeter 90 minutes.

Rattler

JFTR: I expect faouls in chain and with different players on Messi from Madrid side, I expect Pedro and Bojan to play on the Barca side. I expect CR 9 to score, and I do ot expect Messi to score (god is with one team, christianos with the other :) ). R.

Wow, they got a blimp camera to see the tactic setup in top-dow n view, something new for a league game...

Min 10: Looks like CR90.000.000 is taking it personal, nice slip through the legs of a Barca defender, but then persecuting the ball until te last 2nd when there was no chance at al..

Min 11, foul "hard" from behind on Messi inside Madri´s box (yellow minimum), no referee reaction.

Min 12: AAanother hard fould, this time from Xabi Alonso vs. Pedro in the box, yellow alrith, but no penalty.

My take so far, after almost 15 minutes (you need 20 to truly judge): Madrid is trying to play home turf owner with lots of posession and pressure, but in the last 2 minutes Barca recuperated its usual 60+ posession, all is close to the box of Madrid... Madrid Gago fouls Xabi right now, a free kick of the dangerous ones a the box edge (Barca usually does not score those),

Alves shot.... 10 metres above goal....

Rattler

As you probably all have seen, all my guesses were wrong :) ...

CR9 0, Messi 1 :)

Effectivity vs. soccer 0:1 :)

Madrid 0, Barca 2 :)

And this, even w/o Iniesta, the rather hard playing of Madrid and the errors of Mejuto González (at least there I was right in guessing)... Xavi the director of a true orchestra, with thos guys even Spain can become WCs in South Africa!

Forca Barca!

Rattler

A also watched it, the first 20-30 mins gave me hope that it would become a GREAT match but it turned into a nervous game very fast....with the help of a referee addicted to his whistle....

Ok, while the ref indeed was ridiculous, I did not at all see a nervous game (from Barca side), they just played it as any other match, never changing their style. That the surprise of putting Alves as a central defender did only result in errors was rapidly rectified by Guardiola (this makes the great trainer, not the Pelligrini take who only put Guti - with 3 (the first) goal chances within 10 minutes - after min 56 when the boat already was sinking and on the verge of capsizing), this might serv as an idea of nerves, but really, there were never any.

Messi had gone out to find his "great enemy" CR9 - as far as the media had it - but instead (for absence of the former) found him in the referee: First a clear penalty not signalled, afterwards a rididulous yellow for hand game when it was shoulder, and then even threatening expulsion in minute 31 after a "red" foul that kept Messio on the ground. Good for Barca, Messi is not of the verborrheic kind, after the not signalled penalty he wen ton with his "vamos, vamos" w/o discussion, after the yellow you could see his eyes cloud (still no comment), and when Mejuto made him stand up he got angry... asked Maxwell to execute the free kick rapidly, formed the  junction with - genious this night as in all games through the year - Xavi... and scored the goal :)

I saw the match twice, once live, and then again in the early morning hours (check when TA was online here), and it was by no way boring, simply soccer (not too much) vs. money, the "art" versus the "I want to but I cannot" of CR9.

As one article had it this morning: CR9 was super motivated, but had nobody of a team at his side: WHenever he looked around, he did not see anything; to tell the truth, when his team mates looked at him, it ws the same thing, they could not see anything...

Team (6 from the school that did not cost one Euro on the field yesterday fom Barca side) versus highly paid individualists, team won.

Just to give you an example, if you should repass the match you will see what I am talking about: Xavi, surely the perfect director last night (4 assitances in the 2:6 of last year, 2 assistances yesterday), moved about at will with all the liberty Messi has, just in the replays of the two goals you can see that his not fixed position serves so much to disturb the eny. Why can he do it? Because people like Busquets and Keita, who don´t show in any list of geniuses in this match, covered his back to allow him such excursions, and did the excellent team job that in Madrid does not exist...

Same with Pedro, who was quite erraticly acting at first sight, but when you analyze in depth, was closing the passes of Gago and Gaya, opening spaces, and finally, when Messi was drawing them, using the spaace to score.

If soccer is defined by quality (of players), plans, and team effort, then Madrid has the first guaranteed, the second can be doubted, and the third is absent. THat makes the difference, and even a crooked ref cannot change it. (personal take Rattler: There are two more factors, illusion and fun, and there Barca scores big time, just look at the guys having fun as on any street soccer festival).

From my POV not a boring match at all, but an excellently (and this time effectively) executed strategical and tactical plan, a gem all by itself. Even a 0-0 would have made it an exciting game... Barca controled it easily (and without any nervosity) until Guti came in in ´56.

Check out what I said in this 6 min summary (1:25 into the video the foul on Messi that made him finally angry and led to the goal):

Real Madrid VS Barcelona 0-2 Goles All Goals & Full Highlights El Clásico (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t-SiUNJ6Jvs#)

Rattler

again...POV....I wished too see magic and was therefore a bit disapointed
compared to Belgian football it wasn't boring...I just wished to see magic when those 2 battle it out

To make a match magic you need *two* teams that play magnificently in their style and w/o fears, and yesterday there was only one playing soccer, the other did all it could to *destroy* play...

Given that, magic once more from Barca, they can only beat themselves now.

Rattler

They splash out all that money and they still get their butts kicked.
I guess they didn't learn enough from Los Galacticos 1.0

Koen will be pleased:

 Hattrick announces
18-04-2010 Belgium and Greece in World Cup final

It will be an all-European final in the 14th edition of the Hattrick World Cup as Belgium takes on Hellas (Greece) tonight at 20.00 HT-time.

The final takes place under the still ash-free skies of Thailand, but don't jet off just yet because it is all covered right here on Hattrick as well, of course. Very welcome all, and let the best team win!

Good Luck, Belgians!

http://www82.hattrick.org/ (http://www82.hattrick.org/)

Rattler

what happened to Barca Rattler?

hope they performe better this evening!!!!

 :champ: Barca - Internazionale  :champ:

Just chekced in aat min 8, 0:0.

Barca is having a rough time: 3 games a week, no flights, always on the road on bus and hence no time for training (To go to Milan cost them 3 days, exiting from Espanyols stadium). As Guardiola put it: "uckily for us Inte eliminated Moscow, else w would not have made it in time"...

My guess is they will lose tonight vs. Inte, but hopefully score a goal and get the thing fine tuned in the return match in Barcelona...

(While I am writing, Pedro scored the 0:1 after an unbelievable error of the Inter line of defense).

Sic.

Rattler

and I was at the toilet again....seems they always score when I'm going to the little room  :cry:

go, go, go, have a leak, plz... :)

Seriously, now minute 36 at 1:1, now I see what Guardiola wants his pupils to play: Touch and pass, touch and pass, and pass again... High speed, in triangles, seems Barca is gettng the upper hand for the moment, only two acrobatic personal defense actions sved Inter from getting behind...

Now another corner for Milan, they are not yet giving up (and will win, still my bet).

Rattler

min 60:

That is what I like about Barca:

Even being behind 2:1, they still do not change their (overall, there have been adjustments in the pause) style a little bit: Posession, pressure, and short passes to the box. Unlucky again two times, could well be 2:3 by now, INter wil know what expects them in Nou Camp...

(could be 2:4 by now, unjust yellow at Piquets) Actually, again I see a ref who does not sanction the hard entries aginst Messi, but is atent to every little thing Barca does...

(Now, 61, things turn for worse: 3:1... Etoo didnt do it, but the rebound went in, doubtful from my POV - offside?). Better if Barca does not let impress themselves and go for the 2nd, even if it were for the price of a 4 or 5:2... This is what a real future champion would have to go through, overcome and win in the end, long bus rides or unjust goals or not...

Rattler

I like this match better then the one against RM, way better football in general, more style, more technique

Yes, and Milan is playing power play, hoepfully this will cost them in the last minutes.

Anyway not all is lost for Barca, again their triangles work, but of cause the absence of Abidal and Iniesta have been proved on the field to be harming.

Rattler

now i was on the loo... my screen says 5:1?

What happened?

Rattler

EDIT: Corrected it, back to 3:1

Interesting: Milan now defending with (almost) 5...

R.

76: Another hard foul - edged of box - not signalled by the ref, where is he from?

Barca is playing as always... best idea, methinks.

Keeps smelling like the 2nd of Barca is around the corner, but it won´t go in....

R.

and Puyol not in the returnmatch...that will be a miss  :-\

good match, I love these kinds of battles!

Well, 3:1 is surely not the best possible result, but also not anything impossible to overcome, Barca at home plays like you saw it the last 10 minutes, but more successful :)

Looking forward to a very interesting return match next week :)

Rattler

Yeah, with all the lesions Barca didnt have a defense anyway, Puyol out won´t help...

Inieta is well missed, Barca has good alternatives in front, but almost none in the center midfield and defense (after touree and abidal have finished their season). My guess is that Marquez will turn in for Puyol, but a week is a long time ( 3 more matches), so we will let us surprise with what Guardiola comes up.

In Inter, Milito played the best match I ever saw of him, also Barca made a lot of bad passes (not usual for them), and the ref did not help (oh, he is PORTUGESE!!!?? Christiano Country!! That explains a lot....)

Rattler

Ok, saw the match again this early morning, this was probably the slowest and imprecise Barca I have seen in a long time (and for the first time in 3 years lost with more than 1 goal difference). Messi was the best example, nothing of his usual agility and speed. Probably the three days in the bus was the culprit.

The ref indeed was eally hurting Barca: At least one penalty not given (the wnd incident), the 3rd goal now in repetition can be seen and is definitely offside...

I will never understand why UEFA allows a Portugese referee (for example) in a match where one of the trainers is an emblematic Portugese and the rival for the star player of the other for the Golden Ball is also Portugese... To easy to provide stuff for rumours.

I assume the return match will be very difficult, Milan will defend with 8 to avoid Barcas 2 necessary goals, and the Italians are good in that. Let a good counter come through, and the problem will be even bigger.

Rattler

yep, the referee wasn't near top-level and indeed....why a southern ref when both teams are southern
return will indeed be very diff for Barca (with Puyol's abscence making things worse)

tonight: Bayern - Lyon : your bets plz!

I'm on Bayern side and I would foresee a 3-1 win (being positive  ;) )

Bayern should make it, htey are on a rampage...

My bet Bayern vs. Lyon 2:0

TA

boring.... :cry:

and a very DEEP RED card, in my opinion a red card isn't sufficient... a European ban would be much better....seems that the negative vibes surrounding Ribery got under his skin...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/7606850/French-footballers-Ribery-and-Govou-in-prostitute-sex-scandal.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/france/7606850/French-footballers-Ribery-and-Govou-in-prostitute-sex-scandal.html)

here we go again....  Atletico - Liverpool

update: 8'; Liverpool's playing without defence...that's brave...what a mess 1-0

...and Atletico plays only with half attack, only Forlan is there. Liverpool is lacking Torres, and Atletico el "Kun". An inter-spanish match :)

Rattler

I am so out of touch with football here that I don't even know when the World Cup starts :(

I would guess as always the 2nd week in June, I *do* know there are 49 days to go, as this was mentioned on the news and Spain has so many injured players.

Try the calendar:

http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/matches/index.html (http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/matches/index.html)

(Reminder to self: Start a WC topic).

As the WC is approaching, let me remind of how (and what) Italy trains (bunping this one from our first page):

Italian Soccer Training Camp (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wcCw9RHI5mc#lq-lq2-hq)

All, enjoy, and beware!   hihi ???

Rattler

Ok, so tonight is the night (whoever of the two makes the final will beat Bayern is my guess), Barca obliged to score either a 2:0, a 3:1 (with 2x15 min prorogation and possible penalties!!), or a 4:1 or 6:2 to directly qualify for the final ***IN MADRID*** (!!!)...

Already dubbed the "match of the year" I as living here could of cause go on hours telling you what all the experts have been saying during this last week, but lets have a betting round instead:

My specific take on the outcome:

- 3:1 and win for Barca in penalties (my *basic* bet: Barca will qualify).

Looking forward to hear your opinion!

May the best win (and not the ref this time),

Rattler

I saw bayern last night, and they had not much trouble with those french guys ;)

Van Gaal is doing well again :)

well.... as so often I was wrong with my bet :)

Barca vs. Inter 1:0 (2:3 aggregated).

What a disaster for soccer, Inter did not make one attack the whole match and was defending with 9, but then OTOH Barca didn´t score enough versus 10, though playing impressively as always (and with a great goal from Piquets).

The myth holds, nobody wins the Champions twice in a row...

Rattler

sad to hear....I was off to 'Within Temptation' live so couldn't see the match

All Whites in upset win over Serbia


Any chance the All Whites had of flying under the radar heading into the World Cup has been blown out of the water with one their greatest wins on the international stage.

A first-half strike from Shane Smeltz has inspired the All Whites, ranked 78th in the world, to a 1-0 upset victory over world number 15 Serbia in a friendly at the Worthersee Stadium in Klagenfurt, Austria, this morning.

Serbia, touted as dark horses for the World Cup and a team All Whites coach Ricki Herbert believed would test his side more than any of the three teams they will face in South Africa, fielded no less than six English Premier League players while the rest of their squad was made of up players who ply their trade in the top leagues in Spain, Italy and Germany.

But New Zealand looked every bit their equal as their stocks continue to rise on the international stage with what really was a stunning upset, and one which will make headlines around the world.

Just four years ago, New Zealand scored their first ever win on European soil, a 3-1 victory over Georgia, who were ranked about 100 in the world. Herbert hailed that result as one of his proudest moments, but it will pale in comparison to this.

Sure, it was a friendly, but New Zealand will now go to the World Cup with expectations of possibly winning a match on current form.

They were impressive for 60 minutes in the 2-1 loss to Australia but this morning, they looked composed and confident at the top level for 90 minutes.

Serbia, who are in the same group as Australia at the World Cup, were missing two of their top midfielders, Liverpool's Milan Jovanovic and their captain, Dejan Stankovic, of Inter Milan, but it should be remembered the All Whites were without four of their starters from Melbourne.

Such was the frustration of the Serbian fans, they started throwing flares and other objects onto the pitch as the game drew to a close and stand-in captain Nemaja Vidic, the Manchester United defender, was forced to grab a microphone in an attempt to placate them.

New Zealand built the win on their aerial strength up front, led by Rory Fallon, while the midfielders worked tirelessly to break down Serbian raids and the back three of Ryan Nelsen, Winston Reid and Tommy Smith looked comfortable aside from the odd moment in the second half.

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Serbia had the better of the opening exchanges as the All Whites gave away possession cheaply and were forced to defend deeper than they would have liked.

But their goal was never really threatened in the first half despite some neat short passing from the Serbs and the aerial threat of Birmingham City striker Nikola Zigic, who at more than 2m towered even over New Zealand's own tall timber in Fallon.

Wolverhampton Wanderers midfielder Nenad Milijas had the first real chance of the game in the 18th minute but his shot from near the edge of the box flashed well wide of goalkeeper Mark Paston's goal.

That appeared to provide a spark for the All Whites who started to look more confident on the ball and push players forward.

And four minutes later, with their first chance of the game, they struck.

Reid provided the long ball into Fallon, who won the ball ahead of Vidic and flicked the ball onto Smeltz at the far post. The A-League's golden boot cut inside Antonia Rukavina with ease and slotted the ball past Wigan Athletic goalkeeper Vladimir Stojkovic, sending the stopper the wrong way before running to the corner post to celebrate.

It was Smeltz's 18th goal at international level but his first in almost a year.

And he almost had a double two minutes later, denied from close range after Stojkovic had blocked a goal-bound Fallon drive into Smeltz's path.

Noticeably, New Zealand's confidence grew after the goal while Serbia, as Australia had six days earlier, looked rattled when they fell behind with players showing signs of frustration.

Still,  they should have equalised after 38 minutes when Borussia Dortmund defender Neven Subotic found himself with a free header at the far post but he failed to get the ball on target and watched a chance go begging.

New Zealand took a 1-0 lead into halftime against a top 20-ranked team for the second time in a week and given the way Serbia came out after the break, it looked as though they might struggle to hold on again.

But although the "White Eagles" got good numbers forward and started to find holes in behind the defence, a combination of a lack of composure and gritty All Whites defending ensured New Zealand preserved their lead.

Zigic had an opportunity in the 63rd minute but a desperate tackle from Reid made what would have been a simple tap-in a tougher proposition, and Paston produced a good save.

New Zealand had a couple of half chances, both created through their obvious aerial strength that could test a few sides at the World Cup, but they didn't threaten Stojkovic in the second half till, with 10 minutes remaining, Jeremy Brockie, a substitute for striker Chris Wood, had a clear shot on goal but scuffed his left-foot shot into the side netting.

It didn't matter. New Zealand held their nerve in the final minutes to record one of their great wins.

SCOREBOARD

New Zealand 1 (Shane Smeltz 22)

Serbia 0

H/T: 1- 0

All Whites (3-4-3): Mark Paston, Winston Reid, Ryan Nelsen, Tommy Smith, Simon Elliott, Jeremy Christie, Leo Bertos, Tony Lochhead, Chris Wood (Jeremy Brockie 61), Rory Fallon, Shane Smeltz.

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/world-cup/all-whites/3754860/All-Whites-in-upset-win-over-Serbia (http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/football/world-cup/all-whites/3754860/All-Whites-in-upset-win-over-Serbia)

**************************************************************************************************************
Ok I have two questions about this:

1)  When did New Zealand get a soccer team?
2)  Why is Serbia so bad?

I watched Ryan Nelsen play for DC United a few times.  He was a good player even back then.

Serbia has a bad name in the soccer world.
Racisme, racial comments by players and very, very bad fauls commited by some of the players.
And of course the war fought in Jugoslavia which wasnt to good from the Serbian site.

Belarus 1-0 South Korea.
A very poor showing after some rather good performances by South Korea.
Hopefully things will improve by the next match.
Belarus played a very physical game for a friendly and injuries are mounting on the South Korea squad :(

Would be nice to see North and South Korea in the quarterfinals ;)
I wonder if South Africa will add extra security in that stdium ;)
Maybe  we get 2 or 3 referees with bodyarmor and M16 too :)

I don't think any of those two teams will make it that far.

Anyone watch Spain vs South Korea?
Not a bad match... but the South Korean players need to string those basic passes better.  They made some very silly mistakes.  Both sides fielded under full strength sides at least initially.  Both sides had good chances to score.  I don't think there's a goalkeeper in the world that could have saved the Spanish goal that went in.

Corrrect on the "Golazo" (Spanish for "GREAT goal", we add either a magnifying or minifying silable to the original word - "gol" in this case - to say it is big/great or small/unworthy: "-azo/a" or "-on" makes it *big/great*, "-ito/a" or  "illo/a" makes it small) of the first time player Jesus Navas, nobody could have got that one (see 16 scs into the vid, from 24 metres, listen to the "goal singer" from sec 24 to 34... :) ):

España VS Corea del Sur Gol de Jesus Navas 1-0 Partido Amistoso Friendly Match (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2umjduna1Y#lq-lq2-hq-vhq-hd)

OTOH, with this setup Spain is -while a big favorite - not going to win the championship, and it is a trainer thingy:

It seems Vincent Del Bosque (translates to "Winnie from the woods") gets bored by what made the Spanish National team win the European championship: Fast circulation of the ball in short passes while keeping possession (we call that "tiki-taka"), waiting patiently for the chance of the decisive pass into the depth, usually through the center (basically Barcelonas style. Not surprising if you see that the midfield is composed of the "Barcelona Block" Iniesta, Xavi and Busquets, all players with vision and a superb capacity of ball control, imprescindable if you want to play short, fast and *hard* passes on first touch).

So, and as his time in Madrid he made his titles going for the extremes and fast lateral wing backs (Roberto Carlos and Figo in his time) and a precise center he always tries forms to go for this more conventional style, yesterday was an example for this: Navas is the fast wingback model "par excellence", the idea is to make the game broader and so make for "holes" in the defense.

The problem with this is that the team has trained 8 years for the other style (you could see it yesterday: The wingbacks where running, the others watched and waited; in the fast short pass style everybody has to be - and gets - involved, everybody is moving), and are not prepared for fast wingers, the Spanish are too small to use the centers in the box internationally, all norther teams win there by cenimeters in height.

Fine to have a plan "B" ready, but I believe Del Bosque should not let our chance to win a WC slip because of being obsessed with result instead of style. This team is made for posession through short passes, the other ideas won´t work, I fear (even if we won yesterday, the SK team got the better of us during the time where their pressure could be kept up - some 65 minutes - because only half of the Spanish team is involved with this system).

Rattler

Not a good sign for Spain at all since Park Ji-sung wasn't playing and he's the main midfield engine, especially for the attack.  Also, goal poacher Lee Dong-guk was also absent and ball winning midfielder Kim Nam-il didn't play in the first half.  Park Ju-yeong was alone up top and he's not a striker by any means.
Glad South Korea sorted out their right back problem.  That had plagued us for years since Song Jung-guk completely and permanently fell out of form.

Ouch...

It has happened again:

In the friendly against Poland (w3her the mister put up the standard "A" team)  Iniesta again got a muscular lesion, out for 2 weeks minimum (i.e. league round of the WC).

As he is one of the three key players for the "Barcelona style" mid field (Xavi, Iniesta, Busquets), maybe Del Bosque did well to prepare a "Plan B"....

OTOH, until quarters, even w/o Iniesta we can win easily playing Barcelona style (EDIT: As you can see, two more goals to 4:0 w/o Iniesta, against an adversary who is not simply a puppet or sparring partner, but a serious soccer team).

Rattler

LOTS of mishaps these 2 last weeks, many with injuries, how is that possible?

Great day  ;D

South Korea 2-0 Greece.
It should have been an even bigger goal difference but the referee was on drugs.  Still, our guys managed to have enough character to score two nice goals and prevent the Greeks from doing the same.

Argentina 1-0 Nigeria.
Since everyone's expecting Argentina to top the group, the three way battle for 2nd spot is between South Korea, Greece and Nigeria so it's a good thing that the Nigerians didn't get any points today.

USA 1-1 England.
USA USA USA  ;D

We have our first 3 points as well.
Allthough you could see the players were a bit nervous.
However with a little help from the Danes everything went well...2-0 :champ:

guys, we have our own WC2010 topic  :champ::

http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/the-lounge-get-a-beer-go-off-topic/they-needed-12-official-south-africa-wc-2010-thread/msg14469/#msg14469 (http://www.warandtactics.com/smf/the-lounge-get-a-beer-go-off-topic/they-needed-12-official-south-africa-wc-2010-thread/msg14469/#msg14469)

Anyway, SK made it, and deserved it!

Rattler

Goal Cristiano Ronaldo - Iceland vs Portugal 1-3 | EuroCup 2012 Ratings (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FnKBArAueJ8#ws)

'Ronny' has been practicing with 'the wall' being to close...

So, they beat the big soccer nation Iceland finally....  :champ:

Looks like they are starting to fare better over there... :)

Rattler

(http://www.2be.be/hybride_files/fotos/button_cl.jpg)
now on TV: Champions League:
(http://sporza.be/polopoly_fs/1.431719!image/2513565912.gif)Real Madrid - AC Milan(http://sporza.be/polopoly_fs/1.431667!image/2173054844.gif)

any ideas, bets?  :champ:

update 45': RM 2-0 Milan  :champ:

woowww.... this is not the Madrid I've seen in their last games on TV... Ronaldo and Ozil seem to work great as a team  waa

Well, Ajax won :)

Great exciting game with lots of tension :)
Great moment when a player  from Auxerre  waiting to come into the field gets a yellow card for complaining to the referee, and because he got angry because of the card said something new and got a red card...hilarious :)

Yesterday, PSV played against Feyenoord.

This game was a disaster for Feyenoord , the team lost with 10-0......... :whistle: a historical loss for Feyenoord. :D
8 of the goals from PSV were scored in the second half.
In Rotterdam angry supporters were waiting for the team to arrive at the stadium.

Hard to believe that the players of a club of this status did not intentionally lose, probably playing to oust the mister?

TA

Well,

If they continue to play this way they might go out of the Dutch premier league.
There is no money to buy good players, the club has huge debts.
They are now at place 15, third from below.

Qatar over USA for WC? I'd love to see the bank accounts of FIFA's leadership, before and after that vote.

what about Russia for 2012?
(http://witnix.punt.nl/upload/dollar_symbol.jpg)

Russia is a country with a population and number of large cities capable of supporting the WC. Qatar is no bigger than the state of Connecticut, with only one major city. Big difference.

Erm.... there is no WC in 2012...

Next is 2014 in Brasil, and then 2018 in Russia.

And yes, I am sure Russia bougth this.

Rattler

2018...apologies... too many drinks last night  :congrats:

@FacMan: I posted a dollar sign underneath but I see now it's not visible. Russian has indeed big cities but infrastructure? And the distances between the cities forces teams/officials to be transported by air etc.... I do see the difference between Russia and Qatar but the size of Russia is not only an advantage... how much fuel will be spilled during that WC?

Barcelona has destroyed another record:

Since yesterday they passed the Real Madrid of Di Stephano of 60/61 and as the only Spanish team ever now have 16 consecutive wins.

Their numbers are terrorific:

22 of 38 matches played

- they now have scored 70 goals, and only recieved 10, goal difference 60... (Spanish league record in all three respects at this moment in time)

- have won 16 matches consecutively (Spanish Record)

- are undefeated for 19 matches (Spanish League record at this moment in time)

- are in the cup final with Real Madrid (20th April, just 4 daqys after the Real-Madrid League classi that should decide the league)

- are with 61 points 7 points ahead of a Real Madrid (10, but RM plays tonight) that would be leader in any other league with 54 points

- have 5x won at/over 5-0 this season.

- Just its two strikers, Messi and Vlla together have scored more goals than any other team in the league with exception of Madrid

- Messi is leader for striker of the year with currently 27 goals from 22 matches, ahead of Madrids C. Ronaldo, 3 hattricks this season

If they go on like this they will break all existing Spanish records this season (they own the on ofhaving won all 6 possible titles already), and all this playing wonderful soccer for the eye...  :champ:

If no severe lesion of the key players occurs (Messi, Xavi, Iniesta, Alves, Busquets, Puyol) we will see them with high probability in the CL final...

 :D

Rattler

at least this should be called 'impressive'  :champ:

Dutch news Anderlecht - Ajax...
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/1037/Champions-League-Europa-League/article/detail/569022/2011/02/17/Ajax-verpulvert-Anderlecht-en-kan-volgende-ronde-boeken.dhtml (http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/1037/Champions-League-Europa-League/article/detail/569022/2011/02/17/Ajax-verpulvert-Anderlecht-en-kan-volgende-ronde-boeken.dhtml)

And the statistics:
http://sports.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/uefa/boxscore.asp?gamecode=2011021711006 (http://sports.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/uefa/boxscore.asp?gamecode=2011021711006)

congrats  :champ: but the same link twice ?  ::)

Oops must have been the wine :) xangel

still drunk? where's the correct 2nd link?

Just checked, its there......

Tomorrow starts what here is called "The Month Of The Classics".

The "classico" is the match between Madrid and Barcelona, and tomorrow we have the first of 4 within 20 days: Tomorrow the league match in Madrid (in Barcelona Barça won 5:0), then Wednesday the cup final (played in Valencia), and then 2x in CHampions League semi finals in the following two weeks...

Will be interesting to see how Madrid will adapt better everytime to the superb style of Barça, and how Barça will react to that adaption. If we dont have many injuries those 4 matches will be really fun to watch, especially as Barca is playing without defense (Pujol still injured and Abidal, who had played his best season ever, is in hospital with a liver tumor and will lose the rest of the season).

Rattler

JFTR, Eva (our latest member) and myself will follow the first "Classic" tomoorow night together, its part of the Spanisch class I am giving (this part of class of course only to people who actually like soccer, rare thing for a lady).

Rattler

Rattler, what can you tell us about the following video?

 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JE-hX0ZsNg#)

Messi got frustrated after having got fouled enless times by Pepe (who not even saw a card by miracle) and sent the ball volley into the public after one of those actions...

A bit stupid,  but thenn CR7 has done the same in the last classic...

Tomorrow next round, lets see whether Mou again plays with 10 men in front of the goal, this time its for a title and he cannot have the grass high and dry as  it is played in Valencia.

The setup of Mous match was to avoid humiliation, so he chose not to play soccer. Looks ghe thinks Madrid cannot face Barcelona ona face-to-tace level.

Interesting to see how the chess tactics of the trainers evolve through the marathon of those confrontations.

Rattler

Pepe? not surprising.....

when is the next game... I see they are on TV this evening....

next game tomorrow 2120 Belgian time (still havent repaired our clock).

Cup Final, will be very interesting again, as Mou is only training penalties and Barca will send the B-Team (partially).

As its a match for a title, Mou will have to do something if getting behind a goal, this strat of having 7 defenders and at the counter does not work if you lose e.g. 1:0 (OTOH if you lead it might be perfect).

Also, even if Barca plays partially B-Team (to reserve forces for CL where Madrid has asked UEFA to ban Iniesta), it is their *usual* cup formation, this shows they are true to their philosophjy and style. THey might lose (which I find quite probable, but not for soccer but for superstition: Their president bet they would win 5:0, and this is a thing you dont do and usually gets penallized by soccer itself), but they still would be playing perfect soccer...

Lets hope the referee does not fall into the trap of the last 6 weeks constant Mou complaints about the refs "helping" Barcelona on orders from the government... ("I want to play Barca once with 11 people": Well, simply ask your players to not confuse soccer with Roman-Greek wrestling, dont blame it on the refs if they do and get cards...)

Yoou really must be a lunatic to claim that this action was *not* a penalty (though Albiol tried to hide it well, but in the closeup you see what I mean by Roman-Greek reference, still Mou claims the expulsion - last man - of Albiol and the penalty were unjust and another example of "goverment decreted penalties contra Madrid"):

Real Madrid - Barcelona 1 - 1 goal de penalti Leo Messi 16/04/2011 El Clasico Liga C.Ronaldo (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtajFV2TCy4#)

Frankly, a player in an important match does something as stupid in *my* team he would be sanctioned with a fine internally, for deliberately torpedoing the team effort...

Rattler

I saw the news today with a certain player of Madrid who let something slip out his hands ;)
I bet everybody in Barcelona must have been laughing??

The competition here is nearing the end, and its very exciting.
Ajax is second after PSV lost against Feyenoord this weekend, they are now 1 point behind FcTwente.
In the Arena fans cheered for the goals of Feyenoord ( unheard of before) the goals of Feyenoord were shown at the large tv-screens in the Arena during the game.
The last game is....Ajax-Fc Twente.
Never has the competition been so exciting before , I cant remember the last time that a decision could fall on the last day of the year.
And its about time for Ajax to win their 30th championship :)

Well indeed, it was the Kings Cup, shredded to pieces by the Madrid expedition bus...

sergio ramos tira la copa del rey y el autobus del real madrid la aplasta (buena calidad) (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGo7XyCLARQ#)

Now, as I had predicted that Madrid would win the cup (then just out of superstition: Sandro Rosell - Barcas president - never should have uttered that "We will ein 5:0 again, just not to lose the custom...") I now predict that Madrid will face another 18 years of not winning it. just for shredding it to pieces (Ramos now obviously not only is worse with his mouth than his feet, but his hands also suck...).

All this stuff aside, who did not see the Spanish cup final has missed the match of the decade, this time for real: While Madrid  - much to my pain - won the cup, it was well deserved (as it would have been the other way around), first time in 5 years I have seen anybody playing Barca on its level: Madrid finally forms a style and a team, Barca is neutralized in its soccer eshibition...

In a match that had all (incl. basic fairness after the first 15 minutes) the two different styles were expressed fully (first half was all Madrid, fighting, 2nd half was all Barca, celebrating soccer), total exhaustion in 120 minutes, and in the end luck wanted it that (by Ronaldo!) Mou won the chess game on the grass. Impressive, from both sides, a match true dign of a final, the best I have seen in my life time (*Final*, that is...).

Here a nice resumen without comment but saying it all:

Barcelona vs Real Madrid 0-1 - Resumen - Copa Del Rey Final - 20/04/2011 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lg4jXBJD9fQ#)

Personally I really believe that in this moment the hegemony of Barca was broken, by bad luck, but also by better reading the future (what people dont realize often is how close soccer is to life: The government that rules or is wanted by the people has the soccer team that wins, my prediciton now for the May 22 elections is a tsunami win for the Right, as they - of course -  are for Madrid...)

Now tomorrow, part three of the 5 part "Classics" saga (as Barca now has the league and Madrid the Cup, the Supercup will confront them once more), in CL again in the Bernabeu with its high and dry grass (Guardiolas complaint on the one hand served as UEFA decided to replace the Portugese referee that made Barca lose the last Champions league semi versus the Portugese idol Mou, but on the other hand they replaced him with the - officially rated!! - *worst* referee ever, a German, stand by to see some real ref decision surprises tomorrow...!).

We will start seeing what the "new" European soccer has to offer, whether Madrid realy has started to "fly" and whether the cycle of Barca and its "tiki-taka" style really has come to an end (a week ago I would have bet that Barca won Madrid anytime in two matches, but now I am doubting, as the proper players for sure).

Onewards, soccer always holds fantasy and imagination, lets enjoy it while we can!

Rattler

Kevin McNaughton murders Sian Massey (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypOu81UNGFI#ws)

DEFINITELY on purpose! shame on you S-hole! grow up! the lineref reacts quite respectful to herself... the guy just walks away... and the ref takes no action????????????

and Real Madrid are very bad losers... the Belgian ref-team did a splendid job but still RM accuses the ref of favouritism.... sad....

Real Madrid are very bad losers... the Belgian ref-team did a splendid job but still RM accuses the ref of favouritism.... sad....

Now where did I hear that before this week ;)

Today in Holland in the news.
3 supporters from amateur club Spakenburg were arrested.
In last weeks derby against Ijsselmeervogels the referee did not aprove a goal for Spakenburg, losing the game cost them the championship.
The 3 supporters went to the home of the referee, before they got there they called him names at the phone.
They ruined the mans garden and threw all kind of garbage on his road.
The KNVB is investigating this, most likely the boys face punishment by law and a long time suspension of their license to play soccer.

Actually, from my (Barca fan!) referee POV they did suck (but I cannot find any favoritism in thier bad performance):

- The goal of Higuain was perfectly legal: After Pique fouled the Madrid CR7 (who in falling touched the Barca player) that should *never* have resulted in a foul *for* Barca (as it was Barcas Pique who commited the foul) but for Madrid. This said, it would have been in both cases a case of "advantage" (http://www.soccerhelp.com/Soccer_Tips_Dictionary_Terms_A.shtml#advantage_clause), the ball stayed despite the foul from Pique with Madrid´s Higuain, so the foul had no effect in that moment (definition of "advantage" (http://www.soccerhelp.com/Soccer_Tips_Dictionary_Terms_A.shtml#advantage_clause)), and he scored. Perfectly legal and what the rules would have required (Colina was the referee observer, in his time he was the one referee that I adored because he knew to handle the "advantage" (http://www.soccerhelp.com/Soccer_Tips_Dictionary_Terms_A.shtml#advantage_clause) rule so well, I am sure he will have taken note of this absolutely crass error of the Belgian ref De Bleeckere).

- Mourinhos rampage has had its effect: Madrid played the whole match with 11 players, but this also only because of an intimidated and blind referee (Stark was better): Xavi Alonso should have seen two yellows (at least), Abedayouhr at least 3, that wouldhave left Madrid with 9 players. The ref was blind to the agressive take of the Madrid players, many entries from behind with sole forward, all directly yellow (or orange).

So, what do we have? A bad ref who botched up, but surely no favoritism the way CR7 and Mourinho see it (http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=es&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marca.com%2F2011%2F05%2F04%2Ffutbol%2Fequipos%2Freal_madrid%2F1304487060.html): "UEFA robbed the cup from Madrid"

Mourinho is doing a very mellow favour to Madrid by kidnapping the fans and brainwahsing them. He not only sees the "Black Hand" of UEFA, the referees, Mr. Villa and the UNESCO behind "this conspiracy against us", he is now blaming Obama and the CIA (for some alleged communist contacts he had in his youth), as if really those were interested in soccer at all.

A case for the psychiatrist in his paranoia he still has managed to get 60+% of the Madrid fans believe that a conspiracy against their club exists, despite all the facts that point to the contrary (Mou even managed to give a new meaning to the word "fact" by supplementing it by the word "image").

Sad indeed, the cup final was the only game of the classics worth watching if you did not want just to see Barcelonas soccer qualities, and yes:

Madrid are bad losers.

But the Belgian ref team did not do a "splendid" job if you want my opinion.

Rattler

This was an absolutely great and fantastic weekend!!!!

Our national Dutch (under 17) team beat Germany with 5-2 with some very beautifull goals.
And than the dessert, today Ajax became champion of Holland for the 30th time beating Fc Twente with 3-1  :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D :D

What a birthday present for coach Frank De Boer! :champ:  smallclap :champ: smallclap :champ: smallclap :champ: smallclap hatsoff

Barca made the league last weekend here, and my Eintracht Frankfurt (SGE for insiders) now is of 2nd league... crycry  (and just writing this I really shed a tear). Really, with 7 goals and 4 points in the 2nd half of the turnament (19 matches) this should not have come as a surprise, but it still hurts, the only club since the modern Germany (and its league) was founded that had not made it to the 2nd... No Hessian club left in first league...

(http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQdFwx23PeEET5TWlQReiaf53uZVksD88j9yUbyF_LMmO7AMEi7wA)

  :drama: :behead: :pan:

Dont worry, we will come back (one day), with those fans nothing is impossible, SGE 4ever!

Eintracht-Frankfurt: Alle zusamnen, keiner allein (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WP6lqD06rqY#)



standsalute

OTOH. with one match to go, my Mallorca here in the Spanish Leauge even with 44 points is not safe from going 2nd league (and I expect that they *this time* dont do the same as Frankfurt, as was the fact for the last 5 years), this is something unprecedent, because until now you were safe with 42 points, history will be re-written.

I wish the best to Mallorca (crying for Frankfurt who wont ascend anytime soon again) and for Barca against the beast ManU (though I fear the worst, playing the best soccer on the planet does not help always if and when Mourinhous forces take out your players (http://fbbarcelona.blogspot.com/2011/05/uefa-will-decide-today-if-sanctions.html) for the final). JFTR, any lip reader can see clearly that Busquets said "mucho morro!" (= "lot of balls") and not "muy mono!" (= "very monkey") in the incident that has been dencounced by Madrid´s Mourinho as a racist insult (as Pep has it: Only the two know what has really been said):

Busquets calling Marcelo a monkey (Mono) !!! Real Madrid vs Barcelona 0-2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3os6kg5YC5E#)

Congrats Ajax and (Barca´s: 1999-2003) Frank de Boer!

Gosh, now even the trainers are younger than me (41?), I must be getting older somehow without realizing...  hdbng

OK, back to theme:

Dont let yourself be fooled by the paranoid Mou, here a piece of the (neutral) comedy show we have in Spain from December (!!) 2010 *imagining* a (then) hYpoteticxal press conference with Mou: The vid at its time then was critizised heavily because nobody wanted to see that Mou was that way, but now, after the 4 classics and the ridicule he has made of himself (and, whats worse, of the club we all want to appreciate even as opponents: Not much merit beating a 2nd league club...) everybody more or less has understood his paranoia (in the vid he comes in with a transparent saying "Leaders" when Barca had not played their match, when the journalists say: "Look, Barca has just scored, who is leader now" he explodes: "You journalists always are focussing on insignificant details, and, whats more, the goal is illegal, clear sign of how the refs always help Barca...." - and then more...  hihi). He finishes with the (true) words he stated: "There is a soccer rule layout for me and one for all the others" (Hay un reglamento para mi y otro para el resto), and this - as stated - ion Decmeber, since tzhen he has been following this thread to hell.

My bet (and I might be wrong as I dont know how much Florentino is gong to sacrficie to enter the history with titles) is that we will not train Madrid next season. If I am wrong and he does, well: The best buy Barca could have made.

Mourinho: Hay un reglamento para mí y otro para el resto (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dYQXsyl_GtQ#ws)

Rattler

Funny thing happened.
Just as Madrids player, Stekelenburg dropped the bowl from the second floor of the (open) bus:)
He had to let it drop because otherwise he would have hit the electrical wiring from the trams in Amsterdam.
The bus behind his one drove over it, so now we too have a dented prize :) :champ:

End of the movie shows what happens :)
Ajax kampioen: Maarten Stekelenburg laat de schaal vallen!! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqrrzWN8WKQ#ws)

what's going wrong with players dropping the big ones all the time?  hdbng

Belgian football competition: tomorrow evening 1 game will decide who becomes the champ  :champ:

Well, one thing is sure, if he wouldnt have done that he would have been electrocuted.................

video shows he DID hit the cable but there was no electrocution or similar

I cant judge that for sure, police said he didnt hit it, but  it doesnt matter anyway.

Ajax kampioen: Maarten Stekelenburg laat de schaal vallen!! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sqrrzWN8WKQ#ws)

Koen is right: He did not let the "Schaal vallen", it was hit from his hands by the cable.

As my internet conection is slow and vids display with breaks sometimes I had the chance to take a close look at the cables in question: They are *not* High Tension but max 380 Volts, I have myself constructed/used many of them and the type of isolators is tell-taling.

As another comment on my take on Mou: Today a Portugese ref on youtube and publicly announced that Oporto had bribed him with sex, travels etc. to influence in favor of Oporto (with Mourinho as Mister and having the say).

So much for his allegations and insinuations of doping vs. Barca, racist issues  vs. Barca, referees being dishonest favoring Barca, etc. ...

As my father has told me: "Who first suspects robbery behind disappearences does so because its his way of thought: He is most probably a robber...". I guess you get my gist.

http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=es&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marca.com%2F2011%2F05%2F15%2Ffutbol%2Ffutbol_internacional%2F1305474310.html&act=url (http://translate.google.com/translate?js=n&prev=_t&hl=es&ie=UTF-8&layout=2&eotf=1&sl=es&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marca.com%2F2011%2F05%2F15%2Ffutbol%2Ffutbol_internacional%2F1305474310.html&act=url)

I will post an article that sums it up what he does to intl soccer, the Spanish National team etc. tomorrow or day after, got it ready but no time.

BTW, Mourinhos (Madrids) denouncement vs. Busquets was dismissed, the UEFA folks saw "mucho morro", Busquets will play the final.

FWIW,

Rattler

If there's one thing I was happy about, it was those 4 classicos in a span of 18 days or something of that nature where Barca showed they are a better team than an expensively assembled squad that plays bad football.

Tonight the final  of the decade, Barca-Manchester (in Wembley, where Barca 1992 won its first CL final and stripped off its victim status with this unforgettable goal of  - the Dutch player; this for those that dont follow the things so sincerely -  Koeman)

Barca *can* beat ManU, but it will be difficult, we have the two best teams (that live a model of soccer: One from the POV of esthetics, the other from the POV of its mister) as contricants, and both have matured a lot since Rome 2008.

My bet is that we will see spectacular soccer, Barca with the ball and ManU with its stars on cits valid counters, two true *teams* (I think ManU has become better since CR left to Madrid)... I just hope that the match will not be destroyed by stupid or erroneous ref decisions and that no grave injuries will paint it dark.

Msay the best team win and may we all have a great show...!

And, as rumours have it that Guardiola will resign as mister after the match however it ends, lets hope this is not true... (though I would understand, he has won all and can only decline if he doesnt reign like Alex Fergusson for  -how many? - years).

"Forca Barca!"

Rattler

woooowwwwwwwwww ...great game  :champ:

As I have kept it over the last years that this forum has existed I will justz say a few things:

- Great ref, no probs with him even if the ManU goal probably was offside. But, as we Germans say" Offside is when  the referee blows his whistle"... Gotta live with such things, luckily this time the mistake was not decisive.

- Great match with two timid teams: None of them displayed its true power, all were subper attent to not allow the other one play.

- this said, ManU was deceiving me when - with 3:1 in the score and only 10  minutes left they still did not organize themselves and ran around like headless hens wiithout producing any danger. I am not one to pity an opponent who fights, but for Mr. Van der Saar (one of my idols when I played and much longer: On the list of my best goalies ever!  iconclap hatsoff), fopr Mr. van der Saars last match I would have liked something better (I dont see a flaw in his actions, the goals were indeed unstoppable from my amateur ex goalie POV).
All counted,I will finish with my "hommage" following the "....same procedure as every year..."[url=http://someSite]yourText (http://someSite)[/url] (if you dont get it, google my phrase on youtube):

"Blaugrana al vent!!" BARÇA, BARÇA, BARÇA!

Barca Hymn With Lyrics! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vp5vLVBF77Y#)

Rattler

P.S.: And to the idiots I had to listen to right now for the last 2 hours claiming "Catalan" superiority on this planet and asking independence from "the occupant Spanish Fascists": If you think Barcelona is *not* Spain, what does your team do in the Spanish or European league?  

Come on folks: Think! (or renounce right now all your Spanish titles you won) R.

Well done Matt!!!!

Not long ago there was someone who said something about the minor incidents in amsterdam after Ajax party.
I just read the news of largescale rioting and "supporters" assaulting the police with rocks and bottles.

It looks like it was even worse in Barcelona last night :(

The elimination of Ajax from the Champions League was a true scam it seems, from all sides (OTOH lets not hope so, else I would stop watching soccer):

- The two totally legal goals nullified... Portugesee referee when the trainer and three stars of one team are Portugese? Not saying he did it consciously, but when your heart goes with your idols perception can become tainted, UEFA should finally take notice and avoid such situations (same ref, De Sousa, eliminated Barca for two annulated goals against the same trainers (Mourinho) Inter two years ago...)

- 2nd, and worse as it smells big time of fraud, are the 6 goals that Zagreb got in 28 minutes, if you look at the pics and vids you can see the defenders that had gone on strike were laughing their asses off, even exchanged winks with the referees. 92% of Spaniards believe this game was sold (not surprisingly, 5 of the 11 players of Zagreb on the pitch were involved in a betting scandal three years ago). UEFA should investigate, and urgently, as the harm done just by such insinuations to the soccer buisness is immense. Also, players that tweaked matches to influence betting should be terminated for life time, period.

A pity Ajax got eliminated with a 10 goals advantage before the two matches by getting robbed two and made suffer 6 strange ones.

Dinamo Zagreb player Vida in Slow Motion -THE WINK ! (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dc4tJbbamks#)

Dinamo Zagreb VS Lyon : 1-7 & Domagoj Vida & Evidence of Match Fixing (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GA9kpB1H_kM#)

FUERZA AJAX!

Rattler

Tonight (at 2100 GMT) the match of the century, and this time it is (remember it was dubbed the same last season and I said it was not): Madrid-Barca!

Madrid is really much better than it was just a year ago, for the first time in 5 yrs the first match is in their turf, and Barca is 6 points behind (3 on paper, but they got a match more).

During the last 12 years who won the first "Classic" won the league, so this match is transcendental and the signs reversed for the first time in 3 years.

Still, Barca is very much Barca, so my bet is a contundent 1:3... :)

Lets hope the ref and Mourinhou will not be the protagonists again and that no grave injuries occur!

Rattler

Thanks Matt,

I really hope that if the fraud comes out all involved will be punished hard.
But I think it is not going to happen.
If the evidence is so openly shown someone is protecting those bastards.

NP, Stoffel, I hate such insinuations.

Well,, for me it was a "round" evening: No injuries, two teams trying to exhibit soccer as it should be, a fairly decent ref (was his first classic, so some of his nervous reactions had to be assumed, but no grave eror), and, for the first time officially, I won my bet in the bar (116 Euros richer now), Barca won 1:3... :)

After a totally stupid 1:0 after 30 seconds (Valdez, the goalie, simply passed the ball to a Madrid player was how it started) Barca had a hard time to find its place and confront a Madrid very much more physical and pressing (DiMaria and Marcelo were - apart from super goalie Casillas - the best Madrid players for me).

But, Pep Guardiolas bet to set on the only recently aquired Alexis on the left instead of Villa paid off big time when he did what he can do best (and Barca as team not) and marked the equalizer from 20 meters with a volley with his heart in the hand (min. 30 or so).

After this moment the tide changed and Barca found back to its style, the ball started circulating (statistic says they today had the 220th match consecutively with more possesion of the ball than their opponent) and it was only a question of time when the 2nd would fall. At this time Madrid still gave a same level opponent, but after the 2nd goal broke in completely: Looks they spent their physical attributes and strength too graciously, in the end they again did not see the ball anymore, and with the third their morale went down the drain as well.

This is what I mentioned in my earlier post when I said Barca is always very much Barca, they can oonly play one style, and once the knot is opened there is nobody who can stop them (remember that this is the first maatch Madrid lost this year, that is why they are ahead in points and still might make the league, though I doubt it: Morale is a big issue in the consistency test that describes 38 league matches).

Best players of BVarca - and quite unexpectedly for me so - were the returning (after long injuriy: 6+ month) Puyol and the wizzard gnoe Iniesta who really whirled the whole Madrid defense around all by himself in the 2nd half and assisted all three goals even if he was not able to score himself.

No vids yet (and if they appear they get deleted), but will add in a few days when the news has gotten old.

Rattler

Well the first 3 games are played..... and how.
I cant remember the Dutch team lost all 3 group games.
What a bad performance.
We have several issues here.
A coach who has his son in law in the team ( refusing to take him out)and one who doesnt take any risks or doesnt like to change.
We have several "star" players with huge ego's who refuse to play on another position accept their "own",
another group of players who think they are starplayers and a few new comers.
Most of the older players like Van Bommel, Robben, Snijder and Heitinga should have stayed home anyway.
After the debacle at the ( they had some luck here and there to get through) Worldchampionship a new team should have been formed.
Players like for instance Anita, Narsingh were send home in favor of an 18 year old defender who clearly isnt up to the task of playing such important games.Vander Wiel clearly was bad, his replacement at Ajax (Van Rhijn) made you completely forget Van der Wiel was injured and he wasnt even selected.
When you have no leading player to coach the team like we had such as Wouters or Blind you have now chance at all.
There were a lot of egos on the field without a leader only looking for personal succes,( Robben missed many chances and took away opportunities for other players) and that is the main reason for this failure.