Did not want to enter into this deeper as strategically, but as it becomes a *hot* thread, let me weigh in, and on various responses:
Scratch 1 Mig.
Flogger (Mig 23) alright. First thought it would have to be a Mirage (F1?) as they were designed for this ground attack role, but the picture shows clearly the rounded tail and the variable geometry wings of a Flogger, also the ejection seats are clearly Soviet (KM-1, see below).
Is that a new kind of chute or has it not deployed properly. Never saw one that small before.
in one of those videos you see him ejecting right after the hit
you see one small explosion so I assume a SAM?
From my understanding, we see
three chutes in the photo:
Two pilots eject (which means it must be a Mig 23 C, strange to see it in this role), and the photo shows the moment when the drouge chutes (chute #1) of both and the (#2 cute) stabilzer chute of one is visible, latter not fully deployed yet (but in the vid it can be seen it finally did, as well as the third - main - chute after pilot/seat separation).
Also, there is no SAM hit or other explosion visible, the flash you see is the initiation of the ejection sequence.
What you see is the (very old comparitively) KM-1 ejection seat in action: Not a true zero-zero seat (like its western counterpart Martin Baker) it is (if memory serves right) a so called "gunbarrel" ejection system that basically works like a shotgun charge and "fires" you out of the cockpit (often resulting in spinal injury to the pilots because of the brunt rocket propeling force employed). The KM-1M is a fully automatic rocket boosted seat featuring three modes of operation with automatic mode selection based on the aircraft altitude and speed at the time of ejection. It is a ground level ejection seat with minimum aircraft speed requirement of 130 kmph (so its a zero-130 seat).
Sequence (3 chutes system, depending on hight):
Once the Pilot pulls the ejection handle the canopy cartridge ignites and jettisons the canopy which removes the interlock block. Simultaneously with the canopy jettison, a second cartridge initiates shoulder harness tightening and arm protector extension. The removal of the interlock block fires the ejection gun. The seat starts to move, engaging the Speed/Time Computer (KPA-4, PPK-2), and separating the common connector after a movement of 1 inch. The telescopic rail and first stabilizing chute deployment is initiated with a 4 inch movement. After 16 inches, leg restrain is engaged, followed by rocket motor ignition after 32 inch. If below 280 KIAS the first stabilizer chute jettisons immediately, deploying second stab-chute, arm protectors retraction, and engaging separation sequencer PPK-1. If faster then 280 KIAS, this will be accomplished after 0.1...1.6 s according to speed.Seat - pilot separation is after 1.5 s if below 10000 ft with the regular set up.
Modern ejection seats (KM-1 is a ´50s design) have artificially retarded rocket propelling fuel that burns slower and takes longer to develop max thrust (hence less injuries to pilots spines with an MB), but the KM1 has the advantage of working in split seconds and faster than the MB, probably just exactly what the guys in the vid in their high-speed-high-G descent wanted as they only ejected at the last possible moment (hats-off to that excellent timing, by the way, many would not be able to pull that stunt off, maybe we saw the automatic release system of the seat at work here).
Here the KM-1 (which is also used by the IAF in licensed production) in all its (complex) beauty:
This is what it looks from the rear, as mentioned above it is a CR seat (see the interlocking system preventing the seat fired before canopy is released on the right), the springs you see are shooting the drouge chute headset from the central telescope:
Details on what you see in the pix here:
Belgium government is preparing to send 6 F-16s and 1 Minehunter M923 'Narcis' to Libya.
Yes, and Spain will send "2 jet fighters and a submarine", whatever that means...
Or let them sort it out now as long as nobody is massacring women, children, non-combatants.
What other nation would let outside forces put a no fly zone over their country while they were trying to stop a civil war?
With the precedence (of not SC backed) NATO intervention in Kosovo for humanitarian reasons, we can really do what we need there, except any occupation, this *because* Ghadaffi is "massacring women, children, non-combatants", the Lybian civil population, in indiscrimate bombing runs, from sea with indiscriminate sheling and on the ground with paie mercenaries after the majority of the Lybian Armed Forces left him; at least that is for what it was sold to us.
In the news we now have "110 US Cruise missile strikes - Tomahawk", 40 Rafale attacking ground convoys and ships, and Egypt crossing the border and providing the "Rebels" with MANPADs.
Looks all of my three initial ideas that formed my question have come to bear...
I am not sure I understand the way this system works, the west flies around blowing up Libyan aircraft and ground forces but what happens should the rebels advance do western air forces just become the rebel air force and what happens if rebels in their advance start shelling pro-Qaddafi areas do we swap sides?
We will not actively help the Rebels (officially), and we dont swap sides (officially) as we dont have any (officially) but are just protecting the civil polulation of the indiscriminate actions of The Mad Colonel.
What happens if things go wrong and the rebels can not hold their ground even with western air support, do we just shrug and walk away or will we have to commit ground forces?
Indeed, we shrug and walk away: No ground forces deployment (officially and legally), if the Rebels lose despite Western help thats it (but my guess is that wont happen).
Rattler
