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Author Topic: Lessons learned in Afghanistan, the Russian way  (Read 619 times)
stoffel
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« on: 19 January 2009, 16:50:13 »
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Recently declassified documents from archives in the former Soviet Union and memoirs of senior Soviet military and political leaders present the complex and tragic story of the ten years of the Soviet military involvement in Afghanistan.  Most observers agree that the last war of the Soviet Union created or aggravated the internal dynamics that eventually culminated in the dissolution of the country itself.  The documents presented here shed light on the most important moments in the history of the Soviet war in Afghanistan—the Afghan government’s requests for assistance, the Soviet Union’s initial refusal of troops, the reversal of this policy by a small group of the Politburo and the Soviet decision to invade; the expansion of the initial mission to include combat operations against the Afghan resistance; early criticism of the Soviet policy and of the People’s Democratic party of Afghanistan (PDPA) regime; and the decision to withdraw the troops.  Taken together, these materials suggest some lessons that might be drawn from the Soviet experience of fighting a war in Afghanistan.
Read more following this link:

http://www.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB57/soviet.html

Edited by Svetlana Savranskaya
October 9, 2001
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« Reply #1 on: 19 January 2009, 20:41:45 »
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I still vividly recall the invasion on DEC 28th (or at least this is when we learned about it) as it marked a turning point in my life:

At that time (´79) I had been starting my 2nd life phase after the 6 yrs military and was actively studying photography/graphic design in Germany. As it was past christmas only a few students were around and I recall many of them asking us "commies" (actually, socialists: I was, openly, a proud SDAJ member at that time, defining myself - as today still - a "constituional patriot" - what that meant for my mil career is another story to be told another day...  Grijns) what take we had on the Soviet invasion and how we would explain it and the killing of Hafizullah Amin in the context of International Law, etc.

My personal take on that was quite clear: A military and political error with little - if none at all - chance of success strategically and a flagrant violation of International Law, whatever excuses sought.

But our "leaders" thought differently, actually they didnt think at all, and were too timid to speak up thier minds or let us even discuss things:

Nothing of the "heroic" stance that other communists like Santiago Carrillo showed under stress two years later (and that gave us back some of the pride these sissies had destroyed) like during the right wing military coup in Spain, 23F, together with - non commies - Suarez and Mellado: In case you dont recall it there is a video out showing the personal bravery of those three (and the shame of all the others):


Quote
At 18:30, led by Lieutenant-Colonel Antonio Tejero, 200 Guardias Civiles and submachine gunners interrupted the Congress of Deputies of the Spanish parliament. A cameraman recorded almost half an hour of the event, providing the world with an audiovisual record of the attempt. From the rostrum, Tejero ordered everyone to be silent and wait for a competent, military authority who never came.

Whilst almost all deputies dropped terrified on the floor, three kept standing defiantly: acting Minister of Defence Manuel Gutiérrez Mellado, who stood up and ordered Tejero to desist; acting prime minister Adolfo Suárez, who remained sitting down instead of crouching on the floor; and communist leader Santiago Carrillo, who, sitting down, calmly lit a cigarette and did not seem to be disturbed by the events.

General Gutiérrez Mellado, acting Minister of Defence, and Adolfo Suárez ordered the insurgents to disarm. The soldiers assaulted them, following the attack with numerous rounds from a submachine gun round into the ceiling. With the taking of the parliament and the dragooning of the executive and legislative powers, they sought to create a power vacuum in which to establish a new political power.

Moreover, four of the deputies were separated from the rest: the still president of the government, Adolfo Suárez González; the opposition leader, Felipe González Márquez; the second on the rolls of the PSOE, Alfonso Guerra González; and the leader of the Communist Party of Spain, Santiago Carrillo.



So, timid to the point where they almost sh.. their pants for the fairly outspoken and partially physical pressure of our commilitons, instead of saying or discussing anything they strictly and shouting *forbid* us organisation members (- and that in a democracy! ... which to defend politically in serious I only had become a member; You couldnt even become a postal clerk when in the DKP at that time, which clearly was unconstitutional, and we had thought to impose our constitution on politics again -) to make any statements at all until, citing verbally: "...the line of argumentation (Sprachregelung) is clarified, sanctioned and forwarded from our Moscow Headquarters...".

Up to that point I, as an active organisation member, had not been aware our Headquarters supposedly were in Moscow (in my book they were in Essen, Germany), nor that we were supposed to be a multiplier of Soviet Politbureau decisions and line of argumentations. Me and others on the campus confronted the guys (who´s names I still remember but won´t disclose here, cold war after all is over, forgive and forget... Cool ) with what we stood for (supposedly and according to our organisation statutes), and when they did´t want (or weren´t allowed) to concede free speech renounced our membership immidiately and made it public (I guess, technically and on paper I am still a member, never heard anything back form them since though they still exist, and I never even cared).

So, end for me with the socialist parties idea of democracy on that day, I finally had understood what my father always had cited:

Quote
The man who is not yet a communist at eighteen, he has no heart; the man who still is a communist at thirty, he has no brain...



Probably you find that post boring and even OT, but it was an important moment in my life, and on topic, that I wanted to share.

Thanks for your patience,

Rattler
« Last Edit: 19 January 2009, 20:51:33 by Rattler » Logged

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« Reply #2 on: 12 June 2009, 14:23:37 »
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Nothing of the "heroic" stance that other communists like Santiago Carrillo showed under stress two years later (and that gave us back some of the pride these sissies had destroyed) like during the right wing military coup in Spain, 23F, together with - non commies - Suarez and Mellado: In case you dont recall it there is a video out showing the personal bravery of those three (and the shame of all the others)


Whilst almost all deputies dropped terrified on the floor, three kept standing defiantly: acting Minister of Defence Manuel Gutiérrez Mellado, who stood up and ordered Tejero to desist; acting prime minister Adolfo Suárez, who remained sitting down instead of crouching on the floor; and communist leader Santiago Carrillo, who, sitting down, calmly lit a cigarette and did not seem to be disturbed by the events.

Rattler


Yes Gutierrez Mellado had been military since 17, he fought in Franco side during Civil War and in Democracy era he turned to a quite peacemaker, not good seen by nationalist supporters. He acted like supposed to be in that situation, because he was a military.

Suarez had the honor to be a civilian that stood up representing the legitime government leader he was.

About Santiago Carrillo I don´t surprise about his calm, his blood was "cold" enough to stand sitting. This situation was a nonsense after what he lived in Paracuellos del Jarama when he ordered like leader of Spanish Communist (PCE) to kill some thousands of prisioners of Madrid jails (2500-5000 deads) in less than a month (7th November-4th December 1936), I want remember he was 21 years old at that time, so I don´t be surprised of such a calmed acting.

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